Spouse Hunting & Singles in America

SPOUSE HUNTING FOR SINGLES IN AMERICA

🚨 NEW DATING APPROACH ALERT 🚨⁠

On this week’s episode of the Dates & Mates podcast, we’re joined by Brian Belefant, real estate agent and author, who explains how dating is exactly like house hunting according to his 99 rules of real estate.⁠

Believe me when I tell you I LOVED this interview and can’t wait to see what y’all think 💗⁠


Here’s a rundown of today’s episode:

Dating Dish (2:25)

Reba McEntire is all about that social distance date

Reba’s officially on the market and has endorsed the social distance date after healing from a divorce with Narvel Blackstock. Wait… did you catch that name? You’re not going to believe the connection to Kelly Clarkson here.

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What is Emophilia? Is it contagious???

Do you fall in love fast and hard? You need to hear this.

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Match FINALLY releases they’re annual ‘Singles in America’ study

Damona reports on the latest:

  • A surprisingly high number of singles are having sex with a non-romantic roommate
  • Singles have new priorities what it comes to attraction
  • The decline of homogamy

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SPOUSE HUNTING (12:15)

Don’t forget to order your copy of Spouse Hunting: Using the Rules of Real Estate To Find the Love of Your Life

 

TECHNICALLY DATING (31:23)

Submit your questions Instagram, Twitter, or Facebook and hear our answers live on the show! Here’s what our listeners asked about this week:

  • It seems like a lot of men are more lax about their standards right now and I struggle to find people who seem in line with me. Suggestions on how to figure out where I stand with people?
  • I need some social distance date inspiration! What are virtual or in-person activities that go beyond a picnic, hike, or staring at each other through screens? 

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WANT TO GO DEEPER? READ ALONG HERE:

Damona 0:09
you can keep waiting for the fairy tale. Or you can get on board with the new rules of relationships. If you’ve read my advice in the LA Times, then you know, this ain’t your mama’s love advice. This is dates and mates with damona Hoffman. Hello, lovers, I am so excited for today’s episode. It’s a really different kind of conversation today. And the idea actually began way back when I was online dating. You see, I used to tell my friends when I was trying to get them to see the benefits of online dating, I would say girls, it’s just like man shopping. It’s like having a catalogue of eligible bachelors. And I could just pick and choose the ones that I wanted. But the difference is, you don’t have to know if a shirt likes you back when you buy it. So my guest for today has flipped my perspective on this whole conversation and made me realize it’s much more like how shopping, then clothing shopping, because you do need that mutual match to make it work. And just think about the top qualities you look for in a mate. And then the things you look for in real estate, location, style, size. Hey, I’m talking about the house Get your mind out of the gutter. But first before we talk about the similarities between how shopping and mate shopping. I’m going to talk about today’s headlines including Reba McEntire is all about the social distance dating. And what is emo philia. And is it contagious? Plus, the moment we’ve all been waiting for. Well, at least the moment that I’ve been waiting for. Match finally releases its 2020s singles in America study and there are some goodies in here. Then at the end of the show, I will answer your questions including have daters today forgotten all their home training, and some social distance date inspiration. Those are the headlines today and the questions I’ll be answering and now it’s time for the dish. These dating dish.

Reba McEntire is on the dating market and she is doing the dang thing too. She just revealed that she has been dating actor Rex Lin, you might know him from young Sheldon. And they have been doing it social distance dating style. They actually had a face to face dinner date back when the world was a regular place in January or February. And since that time, she revealed that they’ve connected over text and video chat and phone and things are moving along. And I just thought this was a just super cute because isn’t Reba super cute. And B I also thought it was interesting that she talked about the difference in courtship and the way that taking her time and getting to know him slowly, even across distance allowed her to see the real benefits in him. And to get to know him on a deeper level. Even though they’re not together all of the time. They are still able to form that bond, and boy does Reba need it because she got divorced from narvel Blackstock. Is this a name that you know, because it sounded familiar to me when I read it because I realized I also read a story this week that narvel is suing Kelly Clarkson. Why not because he is her former father in law. Did you hear that Blackstock name we talked about Kelly a few weeks ago, but because he’s her former manager, I am seeing a pattern here. He helped Reebok to launch into stardom from country music to mainstream television shows. And the same for Kelly Clarkson. And now he’s common for her and saying she owes him millions of dollars, which made me wonder how did she get millions of dollars for hosting TV shows. As soon as I figure that out, and as soon as I’m able to give Kelly Clarkson some dating advice. I will report back but in the meantime, I think you can take a page out of rebbes book and use social distance dating as a way to really form a deeper bond and find somebody that’s maybe not so money hungry. emo philia you did you catch it? emo philia is the tendency to fall in love fast and often. So I don’t think it’s contagious. I didn’t mean to worry you. You can’t protect your With mask from getting it, but you can become aware if you have the tendency to what experts are calling emotional promiscuity. You, if you find yourself you succumb to others charms very quickly, or you’re likely to ignore relationship red flags, oh my goodness, this happens so much with my private clients, we’ll go through all of the red flags and the must haves. And then you meet someone and boom, you’re just emotionally attached to them. This is a little bit different from anxious attachment. Because if for those who read the book attached, which is a fantastic book, Dr. Amir Levine. He talks about the different styles of attachment anxious and avoidant, but the anxious attachment styles jump into relationships really quickly. But it’s not because of a reward motivation. It’s it’s motivated by inhibition or avoidance of a negative emotional state, especially specifically, specifically fear and anxiety. We’re all moving away from that. So please be on the lookout if you feel that you are an emo Fili AK. And you fall in love too fast and too often. Maybe you need to read up on what Reba McEntire is doing and slow it down. Dr. Helen Fisher always says practice slow love. And I say the same thing. Hey, speaking of Dr. Helen Fisher, she has once again partnered up with a match to do their singles in America study. And she’s a biological anthropologist.

And what they do every year is they take a huge sample of singles, thousands of people, and they pull them on all of these attitudes about being single in America. And then they let people like me talk about this data for for all time. So here are the headlines, I want you to know, there are a couple things in this year’s report that really surprised me. Did you know that a quarter of singles had sex with a non romantic roommate over the last six months in the pan Demi. I cannot believe that that many people would cross that barrier with somebody that they are not romantically involved with. But sexologist call this situational sexual behavior I had never heard of this I’m learning to as we go along. And the meaning of that is that social or environmental factors can cause people to express sexual behaviors different from their previous preferences, and behaviors under most normal circumstances. And this made me worried y’all not just for those who are having sex with their roommates, and men are now going to still be stuck with them for months and months and have to figure out how to normalize all of this. But it made me wonder what other sort of unexpected sexual behaviors people are engaging in because, you know, we we are approaching this period of, of skin hunger and the drought of touch. And I’ll be talking in next week’s episode, a little bit more about that and how that affects us. But just really be mindful of your choices, because they do have repercussions. Most people two thirds a single said they’re ready to go on an in person date. And of course, there was a huge, huge increase in video dating over the last three years, they found they said only 25% increase. I think it’s been way more than that in the middle of the pandemic. But maybe that’s the number that we’ve settled on. So a lot of you have been asking me, is it okay to now move from a video chat to an actual social distance date? Yes, you have my permission, you may move offline. I would prefer you still wear a mask or social distance at least six feet and be outdoors. But you do you boo. The one thing that is really key we talked about this a couple weeks ago, you have to find somebody that is sharing your political beliefs. According to this study. 76% of singles believe it’s important for a partner to share their same political beliefs. But here’s something that was super crazy about that. nearly a quarter of singles change their political affiliation during the pandemic. This is a juicy juicy study this year. I’ve also been asking them to give me some data about interracial dating. And finally for this year, for the first time, they have included that there has been an increase to singles being open to dating people of a different ethnicity 58% increase so lucky all the numbers don’t lie. Let’s all get with the program date for the future. cuffing season is upon us and In a moment, I will be back with my guest Brian bellefonte, who is a real estate agent with a new book and a new approach to dating. According to the way he helps people find houses, don’t go anywhere, y’all. I’m here with Brian Belafonte. He is a real estate agent with some pretty big ideas on house hunting, and spouse hunting. Following an unexpected divorce. He wondered if he could use his set of 99 rules of real estate that he developed to re enter the dating world with the goal of finding a new spouse. He’s written it all down in his brand new book spouse hunting using the rules of real estate to find the love of your life. And now he’s going to give us a sneak peek. Please help me give big smooches to Brian Belafonte.

Unknown Speaker 10:48
Oh, tomato, thank you so much for having me.

Damona 10:50
Okay, this is a different kind of conversation. And I knew the minute I heard about your book, I was like Dayton mates, listeners need to know this. So your book is spouse hunting, using the rules of real estate to find the love of your life. I think this is so smart and such a such a great approach. But I want to break it down so that people are able to follow these steps and then get your book and, and and do it to a tee. One of the important things that in real estate there, you know, buying and selling are two separate transactions. And I think it’s important to keep that in mind when you’re dating too. It’s like you don’t want to buy

Unknown Speaker 11:29
a spouse. And I know that’s, you know, that’s gonna raise some hackles. But you don’t want to find a partner who doesn’t want to find you. So you’re simultaneously Buying and selling. And so when it comes to buying, what you’re doing is you’re evaluating the market to see what the landscape is, then you’re looking at the properties that are actually on the market at that moment. And then among those, you’re choosing the ones that fit you the best.

Damona 11:51
Well, first, we just have to get everyone in the mindset of being the buyer, because I’m totally on board with this. And like I’m always telling people, you want to be the one that’s doing the picking, right, you’re selecting, but you bring up a really good point, Brian, you have to select among the pool that’s out there like yeah, I guess there are those people that go up and knock on doors. I did this actually, I was looking for my house. It did not work. No towball. Listen, this did not work. But I, I had my realtor go and knock on somebody’s door because I was like, I love that house. And that’s like sort of the equivalent of like approaching somebody with a wedding ring and being like, Yeah, I love your ring. Take it off. I love your house. And they were like, Are you kidding me? Get out of here. We’re not selling

Unknown Speaker 12:39
can happen. And I actually have done that. You know, when I was first getting into business school around the neighborhood, just talk to people find out you know where they are with their house, how happy they are? If they’re interested in something, yeah, most of the time now. So let’s translate

Damona 12:52
that to dating. let’s translate that to dating. Should you be having conversations kicking the tires with people not knowing where they stand? If they’re single or not?

Unknown Speaker 13:03
Yes, and no, the way I see it is, it’s a lot easier to go out to the market that is available and looking because you do want to partner up with somebody who’s looking to partner up. And there are a lot of reasons One of them being the wedding ring that people aren’t interested for a while after my divorce. I was, you know, occasionally dating, but I certainly wasn’t looking for a relationship. And so there were a couple of times when people come up and kick my tires, and yeah, we’ll go get coffee, we’ll have dinner, whatever, but it wasn’t gonna go anywhere. And I tried to be clear about it as clear as I could have been. The reality is, though, if you’re looking for a partnership, you got to find somebody who’s looking for a partnership to otherwise you’re just gonna end up being disappointed most of the time.

Damona 13:49
I fully agree, which is why I highly recommend dating apps. And I know people are some people listening might say, well, you’re just saying that because you met your spouse that way. And, and I’ve worked with a lot of the different dating apps, but I really say it for the exact reason that that you say work with the existing market, because you already know most of those people are at least interested in casual data. And yes, I know everybody’s gonna be like, but there are people who will go on the dating apps and they’re married or they’re looking to be polyamorous or they’re not looking for anything serious. Yes, but the majority of the people there are looking for casual dating, or more versus people were like just teach me how to like everyone’s fascinated with my, my social media dating techniques and how to make a match that way. I gotta tell you, it’s a lot harder. It’s far more work than going to a pool of already up already qualified sellers, I guess if you’re the buyer

Unknown Speaker 14:59
Yeah. You’re absolutely right. And I I’m a big fan of the dating apps too, because I met my current girlfriend on Redfin. Exactly. Redfin and Zillow did the same thing, as you know, Keller Williams and the little boutique agencies. And yes, they all have sort of access to the same properties. Because Yeah, you I do believe like what you say and you’re, you’ve said in a couple of your episodes, don’t just limit yourself to one map. Kind of a couple of them got

Damona 15:26
Yes. Yeah. And and like, like you’re saying, Redfin is sort of an aggregator of a lot of different ones. So it is good to be on multiple, multiple apps at the same time. So let’s flip the thinking. Now, Brian, we’ve talked about the buyer perspective. Let’s talk about the seller perspective. What have you learned from as a real estate agent? What Tell me about how the mindset of the seller and the experience of the seller aligns from the dating perspective?

Unknown Speaker 16:00
Well, I think that from a seller’s perspective, a lot of it has to do with marketing, it’s getting yourself out there so that people who are looking know that you’re available. And one of the things that we see in the real estate market is there are buyers markets, and there are sellers markets. And so if you’re in a seller’s market, that means that there you know, there are more buyers out there, then there are properties that to buy. And so all you kind of have to do is plant the flag and people will come. But if you’re in a buyer’s market, then you’re going to have to fight for people’s attention. And I believe that what you can do, especially when it comes to these apps, but all these other channels as well, is do the marketing, you know, position yourself within the market create the messaging that explains clearly who you are, and what you are offering. And when I say offering, it’s like, I do believe that when it comes to dating and real estate, you’re not so much buying the thing, you’re buying the lifestyle, you’re buying the promise that the thing gives you, what is my life going to be like with this person or in this house?

Damona 17:07
And I think you said that, yeah, go on, go on.

Unknown Speaker 17:10
Well, so that’s what i think that you know, that’s what you can do this with the opportunity it gives you with these apps, but also I mean, and I know it apps are easy to talk about, because they give you the opportunity pretty easily. But it’s like, Alright, if you are looking for me, here’s what your life is going to be like when you’re with me. So if you you know, if there’s a picture of me making a face in a bathroom in a selfie, that tells a whole different story from me hanging out with friends, you know, on a dock watching the sunset, I mean, what life Am I offering you that you can see yourself as being part of

Damona 17:46
I love that you picked up both on the storytelling telling element that I mentioned on the show, like tell your story through your dating profile photos. But beyond that, I also do visualizations with my clients. And some of my listeners have heard my ideal mate visualization, where you’re putting yourself in the future of what does it feel like to be with that person? And that’s exactly why I do it. Right. It’s amazing how much overlap there is between house hunting and spouse hunting.

Unknown Speaker 18:18
Yeah, it was just a fantastic epiphany when I realized that it is the same process. I mean, you’re going for a feeling.

Damona 18:24
Right? Yeah. Right. And in a way, you know, my background is as a casting director, in a way, it’s the same thing there. It’s like, how does that person feel in that

Unknown Speaker 18:33
role?

Damona 18:34
But in the book, you talk about time how to stop wasting time with people who aren’t qualified or interested? Yeah. This is one of the number one things I hear from listeners, like everybody’s like, I do not have time to waste on these people who are not a fit. How do we stop wasting the time using the rules of real estate? Brian?

Unknown Speaker 18:57
Well, I think first thing you have to do is have clarity. And the first bit of clarity is what it is that you want. And, you know, if you want a relationship that’s different from getting laid. And I’m not saying there’s you know, one’s better than the other, it’s what you want, you need to know. And if it is that you want a relationship, then it’s easy to evaluate the people you’re looking at and going. Does this look like a person who wants a relationship? If the answer’s no, move on? It’s that easy.

Damona 19:25
Yes, it can be that easy. We make it more complicated. I imagine you see that as well like with, with buyers that sometimes we make it too complicated.

Unknown Speaker 19:35
Sometimes we do and the other thing that it’s hard to account for is that feeling you get inside, you know, you walk into a place and it’s like, oh my god, it’s perfect. And you do that with people and unfortunately, sometimes it It isn’t the right person. It just you know, you get sort of taken down this path that isn’t the best thing for you and doesn’t meet the criteria that you think you’ve established for yourself, but you can’t help yourself.

Damona 20:01
We can’t help ourselves, what are some of the other negatives that you run into with buyers? Like what are the things as a real estate agent that are frustrating about the the buying and selling experience that might be able to be applied to dating, and hopefully help people learn where some of their shortcomings as a data might be?

Unknown Speaker 20:26
I think the biggest one that comes up is when people make a decision based on a feeling without having the information. And I see this, like with house sellers, it’s really easy. People got my house is worth $650,000. Maybe it is, maybe it isn’t. But the value that you think the house has is the one thing that has nothing to do with what somebody will pay for it. You know, and doesn’t matter what you put into it, what matters is what somebody else thinks it’s worth. And this works both ways people think of themselves, you know, not objectively, they don’t mean, I’m not worthy of somebody who’s whatever. Or they think that, you know, I’m too good for that. And I think the important thing there is just have a realistic perspective, like, this is who I am. And I’m not saying that, you know, don’t have high hopes, you should always have high hopes, you should find the perfect person for who you are. But you should also be the perfect person for who they are. Mm hmm.

Damona 21:28
And you’re not making this up. You you’ve, you’ve tested these strategies, you’ve tested them on yourself with a book,

Unknown Speaker 21:37
I’m always I’m one of those people that likes to figure out how things work. When I first got into real estate, I was not ready for any kind of relationship. So I just dove in to work. And I would write down these rules of real estate to help me figure out how to approach approach to the process with my clients. And then when I think you know, things settle down, and emotionally, I was ready to find a relationship. That’s when I had the epiphany. It’s like, Okay, this process can work for finding a partner. And wouldn’t you know, it did, I mean, I’ve got this amazing girlfriend is perfect me, she thinks she’s perfect, I’m perfect for her. And it was using those rules that got me here. So that’s why it turned into a book.

Damona 22:24
See, I love the Curiosity there too. Like, a lot of times we get caught up in in the feeling like you were saying, and also in the feeling of being single, like the commiserating with our girlfriends, the the feeling that the the talking about dating apps, and how frustrating and awful they are. And that becomes an echo chamber of our thoughts. But you actually found a way out by taking this, you know, the love lab of your life, and really systematizing it, which is essentially what I’m always talking about on the show.

Unknown Speaker 22:59
And the important thing too, is that this is a process, it’s not a solution. It’s not like read this book, and you’re going to find the person. Now, read this book or follow your advice. And you’re going to find an approach that will help you find a person. But it’s the approach that’s going to make things more efficient, it’s going to help you identify the people that aren’t appropriate, it’s going to help you hone your messaging so that you’re saying the thing that will appeal to the person that will appeal to you, those kinds of things.

Damona 23:30
So all of all of these things are important as you’re in real estate, you have to have sort of the headline, the hook. And then you have to have the description, you have to have the photos. And then but then there’s all these other elements to the package of like, you know, location, location, location, right? And all of these other things, the schools educate, I’m just thinking of all the parallels right now. And my nerdy brain is just going wild. What I’m curious about Brian, is does this same system work equally from them? And

Unknown Speaker 24:05
I’m convinced it does. Um,

Unknown Speaker 24:09
when I first came up with a draft of the book, I pass it around to, you know, people who I could trust for advice. And as it turns out, my circle at that time was a lot of women. Strangely, a lot of people that I’ve met on dating sites, and we just became friends. And the responses were pretty uniformly Yeah, this is good. This helps the seller I’m not ready for this, but thank you. I can’t see why this wouldn’t work. I tried really hard to make it sort of agnostic in terms of gender or sexual identity. And the people that I’ve talked to have been pretty supportive and saying, Yeah, you did a pretty good job with that.

Damona 24:50
And they’re 99 years old, a little bit about, you’ve told us like, I don’t know. But why 99 is that an auspicious

Unknown Speaker 24:59
number? I

Unknown Speaker 25:00
mean it, when I sort of wrote them all down, it came out to 98. And I thought 99 felt better. So I duplicated one. And the duplication is sort of meant to emphasize the rule itself, you know, in a

Unknown Speaker 25:16
meta way.

Unknown Speaker 25:20
Yeah, that was you can’t step into the same river twice. And what that means is, when you’re looking for a house, right now, you can look from among the houses that are available in the market, but six months from now, most of those will be sold, and new ones will be listed. And that’s the same thing with dating, when you go onto a dating site. Yeah, you’re gonna see the same person every once in a while, but the pool changes people get into relationships, people die, people, you know, get divorced, whatever. But what you’re looking at now is different from what it’s going to be then. And inversely, or conversely, or whatever, presumably, you’re going to be slightly different as well, you’ve matured, you’ve learned you’ve, you know, whatever. And you found things that are more important now than they were six months ago.

Damona 26:10
Well, keeping that timeline in mind, since our lives are dramatically different than they were six months ago. And when I look to the future, I hope, I hope I hope our lives are dramatically different than they are right now. I’m curious if these rules because you wrote this at a time when COVID wasn’t a thing, how did these rules still apply? In a time? So I

Unknown Speaker 26:33
think one thing they help in many ways, I think one of the things that COVID has done is it’s forced us to be a little less quick to jump into intimate relationships with people. Which I think is you know, when it comes if you’re looking for a relationship, you don’t get distracted by as easily or as quickly by you know, that interpersonal stuff, the feel of somebody’s skin, oh, my God, you know, that that could mess with your brain? Yeah, I can.

Damona 27:11
And it does, it does. And when we we forget, like, we want to be so evolved, but we are still biologically wired. And in a way the world that we live in is almost working against biology in some ways, and we’re having to adapt and and relearn, just like you know, you’ve had to adapt throughout your life you’ve had, you’ve had some big life changes, you’ve had a divorce, and then a big move and a new career. And you’re constantly making it work. So I I love the philosophy that you have. I love the book. And I really,

Unknown Speaker 27:53
really appreciate you having me on.

Damona 27:58
lovers, we have more ground to cover in just a moment, I will be back answering your questions on everything from what kind of standards should you uphold in dating today and social distance, date inspiration, you got to get out there and be dating but we can’t have another boring, boring interview style date. You want to know what you can do that will be a little bit more fun. Stick around.

Welcome back. We are here with your favorite segment where I answer your questions do

Unknown Speaker 28:37
damona helped me?

Damona 28:39
This question was emailed to me Dimona at damona Hoffman calm. It seems like a lot of men are more lacs about their standards right now. And I struggle to find people who seem in line with me suggestions on how to figure out where I stand with people. This is very interesting, because the idea of other people being lacs about their standards, I don’t know if this person is referring to standards around COVID dating, which I am finding lean a little bit more towards women being being more

a little bit more more conservative on how far they’re willing to go or how intimate they’re willing to get with someone without knowing their COVID status. But if we’re just talking about standards in general, I think that you get back what you put out. So if you’re allowing people to have lacks standards to treat you in a way that is disrespectful or you’re continuing to say swipe right on people that seem to have put very little effort forward in their profile, then you will get stuck in an echo chamber of receiving those same things. You can go back to the algorithms episode or gaycupid episode when I talked about how You’re, you’re getting more of what you don’t want, sometimes when you are swiping the wrong way on the wrong people. But in terms of how to figure out where you stand with people, I say just go for it. I I’m a big fan of doing either a video chat, or a phone call before the first day and people are always asking me like, last week, I was on the Drew Barrymore show and this woman said, How do I move to the phone call without making it awkward? It’s only awkward if you make it awkward. You tell people what your standards are, you teach people how to treat you. And those who are willing to step up will step up. And those who either feel that you’re too much, or feel that they cannot reach that barrier, they will gracefully step themselves out. But the only way that you’ll know is by boldly making the line and figuring out like, when I do the the video chat, I don’t just say, oh, let’s video chat sometime, or here’s my number call me. I have my clients say call me between six and eight. And then you know, is this person in integrity? Are they good with time? Are they going to respect your boundaries? And in a way it’s a test. It’s not like a test test, but it’s it’s an indication of what their standards are. And that can tell you a lot about their compatibility for you in the future. My next question also was an emailed question. Did I mentioned demona to Mohammed calm, or you can Instagram me? Or you can DM me on Instagram at damona Hoffman? Moving on. This person says I need some social distance data inspiration, what are virtual or in person activities that go beyond a picnic hike or staring at each other through screens? Well, I think that we can get more creative with the staring at each other through screens. I like to gamify that first date, maybe doing 20 questions playing, playing taboo, doing a sip and paint night, somehow bringing in an activity that takes the pressure off the staring at each other through screens. I’m a big fan of the hike. I think hikes are great. The weather is going to turn a lot of places. So enjoy. Enjoy it while you still can. I’m from the Midwest, you guys know. So I have been through all the seasons. Now I live in California, and I don’t I don’t deal with that anymore. But I can relate. So y’all need to step up your your cuffing season game right now. Go for the hike. But okay, you don’t want to do hike, look, do yoga in the park. You can stargaze in your own backyard like I have a an app that tells me what the constellations are on my phone, you could do that. You could do do a virtual escape room or do like a virtual I did this virtual game through let’s called let’s roam. It’s an app. It’s really fun. And it’s like a scavenger hunt. And so that can make your virtual date really fun. Or it can make your in person date really fun. If you do it together. Do a book club, get creative, get creative, and it’s not going to just happen naturally. You have to you have to make the dates more fun, you have to come up with ideas that get you out of the box. Because believe me, it’s easy. I understand. I am tired in this quarantine. And I’m tired of this quarantine. I fully understand how it’s much easier to just Netflix and chill. And it’s much easier to just be like, oh, let’s go for a walk or let’s go to the park. But if you put in just as much more more effort, you can get a lot more bang for your buck and find you’ll have more to talk about you’ll have a better time and you will feel less like you’re wasting. You’re wasting time you’re wasting connections if you are just going to the dates by rote so I hope those social distance date ideas give you some inspiration. And be sure to check out the dates and rates blog for more tips and more social distance date ideas and dating advice. This is Episode 331 updates and mates. Check out Brian’s book to y’all. This is so revolutionary. I so loved my conversation with Brian. We will put the link to the book on Amazon but you can also look up spouse hunting using the rules of real estate to find the love of your life. I want to hear your questions. We’re doing something special in a few weeks with the deer demona I’ll tell you about in a few weeks, but in the meantime, I want to hear your questions. So DM me at damona Hoffman on all the socials. And by the way, do not forget we need those ratings and reviews so we can heal all those hearts. You’re a part of a movement So, do your part. Just take us I swear 90 seconds it’ll take you 90 seconds. You can do a rating and a review and thank you to all of those who have done that already. I loved reading from marquees who said even while you’re locked away, listening to Dimona can help you find love. She’s the absolute best. You’re the absolute best marquees you leave me a review like that, I’ll be sure to shout you out on the show. I’ll be back again next week with Dr. Laura Berman. We’re going to talk about skin hunger, and so much more. You may remember her from her own radio show. She’s also been on the Steve Harvey show. This is a hot one. Make sure you’re subscribed so you get that the minute it posts. Until next week. I wish you early voting and happy dating

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

 

Single Shame & Women’s Intuition

SINGLE SHAME

So right now I’m feeling some frustrated big single energy from some of my listeners.

Many of you are writing in, feeling like time is passing you by – especially right now.

So, today is all about refocusing that energy and reexamining any shame you’re carrying around singlehood so you can move on with your love life.

To do this I’ll be welcoming to the show to Dr. Karin Abrell, author and host of the “love and life” podcast.

She spent 27 years as a single woman looking for the love of her life and thought she was doing something wrong. Her story has a happy ending and I can’t wait for her to tell you what she learned along the way.

Let’s dish!

Dating Dish (2:16)

Eric Benet

Eric Benet believes birth control is being given to the wrong gender. Damona weighs in.

Beard Baiting

Men have been growing out their beard to increase their dating success, a term that has now been called “beard baiting”. 

Danica Patrick

Danica Patrick says she now know what she’s looking for after her recent breakup.

DEMI LOVATO (9:03)

Demi Lovato breaks off her engagement with Max Elrich. They were only dating three months before getting engaged. Damona weighs in.

THE POSITIVE OF BEING SINGLE (12:55)

Dr. Karin Abril shares tips she learned from her experience of 27 years in the dating scene.

  • encouragement and empowerment to singles to help them remain strong in the midst of single shaming, stay true to themselves
  • never settle for a less than extraordinary relationship
  • Be happy, hopeful, and positive because the happier you are when single, the happier you’ll be when married!
  • Resist the “you need to change to snag a man” protocol of typical self-help fare.

The audio version of the book is coming out next month “Single is the New Black: Don’t Wear White ‘Til It’s Right”

TECHNICALLY DATING (36:20)

Submit your questions Instagram, Twitter, or Facebook and hear our answers live on the show! Here’s what our listeners asked about this week:

  • Instagram: Any dating advice for high libido demisexuals?
  • Patreon: I was being nosy and looked into his wallet because I thought he was hiding something (which he may not have been). He was embarrassed and we got into a fight at dinner. It was heated and I accidentally spilled our drinks all over him. I feel kind of bad now. Is there a way to get out of the dog house?

Cosmopolitan Mag & Safe Sexting

U UP?

So remember back in the old days – like last year – when you were in the mood for a booty call and all you had to do was send a simple “u up?” text??

via GIPHY

Are you now prefacing your “u up” text with a COVID questionnaire? – have you come into contact with anyone with Covid-19? Have you been out of the country in the last 4 weeks? Do you have a cough, fever, shortness of breath, or any other symptoms possibly related to Coronavirus?

Just kidding please don’t do that. We’d much rather you start with virtual dating than put you at risk or risk turning a new partner off completely.

But to make these new connections, we’re having to reexamine our strict “no sexting” policy? If you can’t have real casual sex in today’s world, can you have virtual sex?

Today we called in Taylor Andrews – sex & relationship editor at Cosmopolitan Magazine! She’s here to give us the new rules on romance in 2020 and tell us about the trends that have come across her desk and her forthcoming book Cosmo’s Fantasy Sex Games.

Disclaimer: We don’t get too graphic in this episode but we do talk about sexting and the book Cosmo’s Fantasy Sex Games soooo, now you can’t say you weren’t warned. 

But first, we dish!

DATING DISH (1:28)

The Universities with the best dating scene

StuDoc has found that Utah Valley University, Brigham Young University, California State University Fullerton, Northeastern University, and University of Virginia have the best dating scenes. It might surprise you to know that BYU was actually the student population that popularized Tinder! This is relevant to you and your dating life. Damona explains why.

via GIPHY

Are you sexy?

There is now actual proof that if you feel hot (read: aroused), you are more likely to find the confidence to make a date happen. Damona breaks it down.

via GIPHY

Stars, they’re just like us

Drew Barrymore shares that she, too, gets stood up by random dudes on dating apps. WTF?

via GIPHY

SAFE SEXTING TIPS (11:00)

Everything you need to know about safe sexting from Cosmopolitan Magazines very own, Taylor Andrews!

via GIPHY

We discuss:

  • Why right now is definitely the best time to date
  • Sexting, how do you do it?
  • Hookup advice
  • Did we take a peek at Chris Evans’ dick pic??? Maybeeee…
  • Sexy Fantasies

Pre Order your copy of Cosmo’s Fantasy Sex Games Here! https://amzn.to/3cA3jsN

Make sure to check out Taylor’s work in Cosmopolitan Magazine for all the juicy news!

TECHNICALLY DATING (29:40)

Submit your questions Instagram, Twitter, or Facebook and hear our answers live on the show! Here’s what our listeners asked about this week:

  • Email: I am 39 years old and have been on dating apps for 13 years. I haven’t been physical with someone in over 3 years. Someone asked me to come over sat night for drinks, bonfire, and sex and I’m wondering if I should just go for it? I’m worried I’ll catch feelings.
  • Women’s Group: I met a guy on Hinge a few months ago. We’ve had 2 socially distanced dates in person and everything seemed to be going great. We both got really busy with work, but he said “if we want more we have to see each other more and talk more”. I agreed but since then he’s been distant. I set a date with him for dinner, but when I called him to make a plan he didn’t answer and hasn’t called since. Should I try again to make this happen or is it over/?

WANT TO GO EVEN DEEPER? HERE IS A TRANSCRIPT OF THE SHOW IF YOU WANT TO FOLLOW ALONG!

Damona  0:00  

Hello lovers, it’s Dimona. I have a new goal of reaching 10,000 more hopeful romantics before the end of 2020. But I need your help. There are three quick and free ways to support the show and spread the message of love. Number one, subscribe. Okay, look at your phone right now. And tap the subscribe button if you’re not subscribed already. And then you’ll get every episode The minute it goes live. Number two, rate and review. If you’re liste ning on Apple podcasts, go ahead and scroll all the way down to the bottom where it says ratings and reviews. Then click as many of those five stars as you want. Maybe five if you’re feeling frisky, and then you can even click write a review to tell everyone why you listen. And number three, share tell your friends about us. Click the three dots by this episode and dm it to a friend who needs to hear this advice. do three and keep dates and mates free for eight more seasons. And we can reach our goal together of healing those 10,000 hearts. Hey, Hey, Hey, welcome to dates and mates. So remember back in the old days, like last year, when you were in the mood for a booty call and all you had to do was send a simple you up text. Now are you processing your uop text with a COVID questionnaire like have you come into contact with anyone with COVID-19? Have you been out of the country in the last four weeks? Do you have a cough fever, shortness of breath or any other symptoms possibly related to Coronavirus? kidding. I’m kidding. I’m kidding. Do not do that. Please. I would much rather you start with virtual dating then put you at risk or risk turning off a new partner completely. But to make these new connections, I’m having to re examine my strict no sexting policy. If you can have real casual sex in today’s world, can you have real virtual sex? Today, I called in Taylor Andrews, sex and relationship editor at Cosmo magazine. She’s here to give us the new rules on romance in 2020. And tell us about the trends that have come across her desk and her forthcoming book, the cosmos fantasy sex games. First though, we got to get you all up to speed on what’s going on in the news. We reveal the universities with the best dating scene. And will you really look sexier? If you feel sexier? Plus stars they’re just like us. Drew Barrymore reveals her big dating app debacle. Then at the end of the show, I will answer your questions including I need intimacy, but I’m worried I’ll catch feelings. And is he busy? Or just not that into me? disclaimer folks. We don’t get to graphic In this episode, but we do talk about sexting. And of course the book Cosmos fantasy sex games. So now you can’t say that you weren’t warned. Let’s dish Our first story actually comes to us from Stu docu which is an online platform with study tools for students. They surveyed over 100,000 students from 15,000 universities to find the schools with the liveliest dating scene and some of the top five might surprise you. Number one was Utah Valley University. Number two was Brigham Young University number three, Cal State Fullerton where I have spoken before number four, Northeastern University, and number five University of Virginia. I don’t even have to look at all the results to know that my own college didn’t make the cut because the dating scene there was dead.

 

But here’s what’s really interesting, Brigham Young University for those of you who have been listening to the show for a while, you know that this is not the first time that I’ve highlighted Brigham Young University in a dating dish. Because back in 2013, this school, which has a high number of Mormon students, a big Mormon population was actually the school that put Tinder on the map. And here on dates and mates in 2013, you could hear me talk about how this new app was taking the dating world by storm. And it was sort of launched there at Brigham Young. And so it wasn’t actually even a hookup app, as a lot of people were saying in the beginning. They did seed it at a lot of universities, and it really took off at Brigham Young. And they even reported later that year in 2013, that it had led to a number of marriages of people who had matched on Tinder and then moved into serious relationships and become engaged with even just a few months. So I totally buy the stew doc you survey I will put a link to it in the show notes. But I would say if you want to know what’s going on dating and relationships, you should probably figure out what’s going on at Brigham Young University. There’s more news that’s fit to print, psychologists have been examining something that’s called the biased perception of romantic success. What they mean by that is this idea that when you feel sexy, you will be considered sexy by other people. And, you know, we you’ve probably heard me say that on the show before, I’m sure lots of dating experts say like, you know, you feel good, then you’ll look good. It’s, it’s, it’s a mindset. You know, mindset is everything. But according to research, it’s really, really true. And when you present yourself as feeling sexy, you actually are reducing your fear of rejection. And you’ve heard me say this on the show as well, that, that we need to just be more confident and not get attached to the outcome. Okay, here is how this study worked. And I can’t believe there are people that get paid to do this kind of research. But hey, I get paid to do this. So anything goes, they showed sexually stimulating images to people in a clinical setting, before introducing them to a stranger of the opposite sex. And then they had a neutral conversation just about like, hobbies, career goals, blah, blah, blah. But they found that those who had been exposed to sexual stimulus rather than neutral stimulus, something not so sexy, those who were exposed to it were more likely to initiate more intimate contact and be more interested in initiating a romantic relationship at the end of the session. And what this does is it confirms that when you feel sexy, you’re more likely to take a risk. And so often I say that, that success in dating, some of it is just if the other person is feeling the vibe from you and feeling like you’re into them, a lot of times that can amp up their interest in you. Well, one person who I think, should have lots of interest on dating apps is Drew Barrymore. But it turns out, it has not gone the way that she planned it, she revealed on and watch what happens live with Andy Cohen that she had been on Riah and she thought the app would fulfill her lifelong dream of going on a blind date. It’s really hard to go on a blind date when you’re Drew Barrymore because everybody knows everything about you. And you don’t know who these people are, but Riah, you know, is for the celebrities. But she said that her first day was a train wreck, she said she got stood up. And actually, I can also reveal on the show, she told me this story not too long ago, because I am also one of the dating experts of the Drew Barrymore show. I’ll be on my first show live this Wednesday at 9am. Eastern in New York live, but check your local listings to see when I will be on in your area. But here’s the thing if this can happen to Drew, and let me tell you, she is so sweet. And she’s so charming and everything that you see about her and ROM coms. It has been my experience of working with her on her show as well. It happens to everyone and and you have to do the same sort of work whether you’re Drew Barrymore or the girl next door, you have to make sure that you’re pre qualifying people before you get to the date. If this person would stand up Drew Barrymore they certainly will do it to you. And then you know if this person doesn’t show up for you, that this is not meant to be but it doesn’t mean to you should throw the baby out with the bathwater. It doesn’t mean you should give up on dating apps. And I hope drew doesn’t give up on Riah but she certainly hasn’t given up on love. So look out for me on Wednesday, spreading some more romantic cheer on her show. Those are the headlines for this week. But when we come back, we will be with Taylor Andrews from Cosmos Oh, get ready for some juicy talk in just a moment.

 

I am here with Taylor Andrew, she’s cosmopolitans, assistant editor of all their juicy dating relationships, sex and love content. Please help me give big smooches to Taylor Andrews. Hey, Joe, how’s it going? It’s going girl. First of all your articles are fire. And we have referenced them a lot on the show in the past, but you are really on the cutting edge tailor of what is happening in dating and relationships. And people are always asking me, like what is the deal with dating apps? And should we even be trying today? Is it too complicated? Now there’s woke fishing. I have to know their COVID status is dating just to complete hated right now.

 

Unknown Speaker  10:02  

Honestly, I would almost argue on popular opinion that right now is the best time to find someone in a relationship, if that’s what you’re looking for. And I’m going to tell you why. I think right now, people are not leading with physical like intimacy. Obviously, we’re in a pandemic, you can’t go meet someone in person, if you are, you’re meeting six feet apart, and you’re outside, it’s just different circumstances. But right now, you’re really getting a relationship, like via text message via zoom via FaceTime. And you’re communicating and talking to these people before you even add in the whole physical element. So you’re getting to know them, you’re getting to know like, what they like who they are way more in depth than you would if you were seeing them on a first date. So I would actually argue that right now is the best time to actually successfully find a solid relationship.

 

Damona  10:52  

You know, what I will cosign on what you just said, I actually was just talking to a former client yesterday, who is in the best relationship of her life, she met this guy two and a half months ago, in the middle of a pandemic, on a dating dating app. And she said, it’s just a totally different trajectory, like it’s unfolding in a completely different way. And she’s, you can really tell, if you are, if you’re on a date with somebody, you don’t have all the distractions of everything else that we use to get our attention or keep our attention on a date. It’s just the two of you talking and connecting, you really can’t have the other distractions. And you know, is this really the real deal or not? So she said, she’s, like, deeper in this relationship than she’s been on any other relationship before,

 

Unknown Speaker  11:45  

right? I mean, everyone’s on dating apps. Right? Now, if you’re single, you’re on a dating app. And actually, for cosmopolitan readers, 51% of our readers are on dating apps. So that’s like a high percentage, considering that some of our readers are also in relationships. So if you consider how many people are on dating apps, you’re going through a lot of different people, you get to fine tune and select who you want, who matches like your personality, what you’re into, I just think you’re gonna you’re getting so much opportunity right now today that you can absolutely find someone who is like, on the same level as you. And yeah, I mean, like I said, whether you’re on dating apps, because you’re bored and lonely, and you don’t have anyone to talk to you, or whether you’re actively trying to get a relationship, I completely agree with you now would be a great time to, I think, if that is what you’re looking for, to get into a relationship.

 

Damona  12:37  

And I do feel like, as you said earlier, there, there isn’t as much of that physical interaction with strangers. So I feel like a lot of those people have fallen off the apps. And one reason that a lot of people feel like, it’s not a great time because they don’t feel like as much is happening. Because we were we were at a an unsustainable pace of dating, I feel like before the pandemic, and I feel like something had to happen to stop that crazy cycle of like, swipe, swipe, swipe date, date, date, totally, you know, with wash, rinse, repeat. I wish it wasn’t a pandemic, of course, but it happened. But there’s so many other factors right now. Like, like, it’s 2020. Like everything that can happen, will happen. And there’s so much else that is affecting dating today. Right from race. We’ve talked at nauseam on the show about race and dating to the the election coming up. And we had your friend in mind, Michael Kay from Okay, Cupid, on the show to talk about that. What do you think do you think that people are finding are looking for the wrong? Like? Are they focused on the wrong things right now? Or is it just like that we are at a time where we have to, we have to kind of cut out the clutter and find somebody that’s totally aligned with us on so many different levels?

 

Unknown Speaker  14:06  

Well, it’s interesting you say that, because I’m actually currently working on an article of it’s a debate and it’s can you actually be in a relationship with someone who has opposing political views? I, I would argue, especially with the year 2020. I would argue that you can but you wouldn’t. You would be surprised by how many people believe that yes, you can be in a relationship with someone who has opposing political views. So while I do think that this year has definitely made it so that women are maybe, I don’t know not being as picky or anything just because they are lonely on dating apps, I do think if you want a successful relationship, now would be the time to like I said, fine tune and find people who agree with you and align with you on topics like race and LGBTQ policies and and everything in that regard and even more, so than Now you can do that because you are talking to them via dating apps and texting. And it’s a less intimidating conversation than asking someone in person. So how do you feel about our current administration? And what are your views about who should be the next president, etc, etc. Yeah,

 

Damona  15:16  

they used to say don’t talk about those things on first dates. But I almost feel like now, it’s like you must talk about these things, first dates, just just to figure out if they even meet meet the basic criteria.

 

Unknown Speaker  15:28  

Totally. So the

 

Damona  15:30  

The other thing that now we are dealing with since we are distanced from whoever we are matching with or talking to, is how to keep that chemistry and communication and flirtation going in the digital space. You have written this very hot and sexy new book, Cosmos fantasy sex games. And we’ll give everybody a little peek inside. But I think one one element that is really pertinent to our listeners is sexting. Like, yeah. What are the rules for sexting now, especially like, if you are talking to so to, essentially a stranger, someone you met on a dating app? Maybe you haven’t actually moved offline with them? Are there different rules for them versus someone that you’re already in a relationship with?

 

Unknown Speaker  16:20  

I think, okay, the number one thing I can say is, men, can we stop with the dick pics? I mean, right? Can we please please like, Listen to me, listen to everyone who’s been saying this for however long, the dick fix needs to stop. Unless it’s consensual. And unless the woman specifically asks to see your penis, women do not want to be surprised by a dick pic and their phone. So that’s like sexting rule number one, do not send unsolicited nude pictures to the other person. So that’s the biggest thing. As far as everything else, it really just depends on what you’re into. And what you and your partner have consensually agreed upon. So what I always like to encourage is I know people really struggle with sex either, like I just can’t figure out like what to say, I feel so awkward. I just I don’t know, I would just start if this is someone that you’ve slept with before, I would start by, you know, recounting your experience with them. So Oh, remember when you did this with me, or remember when you touched me here or remember when we were in the laundry room or whatever you’re doing, and then just start from there. It’s like retelling the story. So then it gets you started. And then the other person is seeing what you’re doing. And they can add in. And then you can start saying things like, Oh, well, wouldn’t it be so hot? If we try this next time? Or what do you think about this? So I think that’s a really easy way to transition into sexting with someone that you’ve already slept with. And in the case that you haven’t slept with someone, I always like to go for like, encourage the conversation. That’s Oh, I wish she were here. I think that that is always the way to get someone to be like, Oh, well, it piques their interest. And so we do fiber there. Exactly, exactly. It’s not you’re not being you know, super, super direct. You’re not saying let’s sex right now. It’s just Oh, I wish you were here and it gets the conversation started in a non intimidating way. It’s really easy for the other person to like, jump in into the conversation. So that would definitely be like, my starter. I mean, what do you what do you think about sexting? What, like, what are your tips?

 

Damona  18:29  

Well, I I’m kind of cautious about sexting, like, in terms of sensitive images. Like, look, we just saw this not that long ago with Chris, Chris. And like, you know, the dick bickered route.

 

Unknown Speaker  18:47  

That was an accident, like,

 

Damona  18:49  

I actually do, because I’ve had, I’ve had, like, I’ve had pictures that I did not intend to put, I’ve had, like, have you had this happen on Instagram, where you were like, like chatting with someone or in a store in stories, and then all of a sudden, it was like calling them I need to fix this? Because I’m like, sorry, I’m not trying to suddenly call you like, it’s just in the middle of the conversation. You’re right. So I think it could have been an accident, but I think it maybe it was a happy accident. after all. I think it’s probably for him going to enhance his life more. It’s been it’s going to hurt him. But you know, you do work for cosmopolitan, female focused female first, like, what would happen if that was a woman? It would be a completely different conversation. If you know, it’s like a teddy pic.

 

Unknown Speaker  19:38  

Right? I would and we’ve had celebs things like this get leaked. Um, you know, like it happens. Um, and it Yeah, I don’t know that. That’s an interesting conversation because it is like the difference between you know, he, I don’t I don’t know. It’s um,

 

Damona  19:58  

it’s complex, isn’t it?

 

Unknown Speaker  20:00  

It is I wish I had more of an opinion on it, but I just can’t even.

 

Unknown Speaker  20:04  

It just doesn’t happen.

 

Unknown Speaker  20:06  

It doesn’t. So, as far as explicit images go, I’m sure everyone was really happy to see that. But that was like, you know, that’s breaking a barrier. Even though it was accidental, you know, that’s even if you would put that into terms of like dating someone in general. Again, like I said, you should not be sending dick pics. So the fact that that happened is not not a good example.

 

Damona  20:30  

Yeah, cuz then you took the dick pic it What was your intent with the dick pic? That’s that’s the other question.

 

Unknown Speaker  20:35  

Exactly. Do you

 

Damona  20:36  

like what you said, Taylor, in terms of using it to build anticipation is how I would how I would phrase that like saying, Oh, I can’t wait to see you again. And really thinking of sexting as an element in for prep for thinking of sexting as an element of foreplay, and really, look giving yourself something to look forward to. And then the other thing I love about what you said, was storytelling. That’s so much of I mean, you know, the book is the fantasy sex games, it’s the fantasy, it’s telling the story of what’s going to happen. And I know, for me, I sometimes feel a little awkward, maybe, maybe it’s because of my husband’s reaction. He’s like, so uncomfortable with it. But it can be awkward, right? to, like, send that first sext and to step into the roleplay space. How you

 

Unknown Speaker  21:28  

gonna? Absolutely can’t and that’s normal. You know, if, if I could say anything, we actually have this segment in the book called finished the fantasy, where we set the whole fantasy up, we type we have it written out. So you just read it with your significant other, or whomever you want to sex with, or whatever. And then you finish it. So we already did all the hard work for you, we initiated the conversation, so then you just finish it.

 

Damona  21:53  

That is so perfect. And this is why I also help people with dating apps, like just getting started, like having the prompts or having the outline. And then once you’re in it, it’s it does feel more natural. Right. Yeah. You know what to say? Yeah, but it’s that, that anticipation and and awkwardness of just getting started that sometimes keeps people from

 

Unknown Speaker  22:18  

trying?

 

Damona  22:20  

The thing, like the thing I loved about the book is, it is so playful, and there’s so many ideas in there. Like you might read through it, and you’re like, Whoa, not that for me, but you might read some and think, oh, I’ve never thought of that. I’ve never tried that. I was like, how did Taylor get all these ideas?

 

Girl, you know, no, you know, I read the book. But when if you’re with a partner, some of it is just that willingness to explore and try something new, you know, especially in quarantine, we’ve been locked up. And it’s been like, same old, same old For how long? We’re all stressed out overworked. Why not? Why not? Try something new with your partner?

 

Unknown Speaker  23:11  

Absolutely. And I think it also goes into, you know, I don’t know, we’re speaking to women of you know, all sexual orientations. And they’re in relationships, and they’re single and whomever or, and whatever. But, um, I just think that like, quarantine is the best time to really have fun with all of this, and you’re with your partner all the time, might as well just make it fun and do something different than what your normal circumstances like, there’s no reason why you can’t have fun and go pick out a Halloween costume that’s leftover in your closet from five years ago and have a little roleplay situation with that. And and while I understand that it can be intimidating. I think it starts with you know, kind of breaking down that wall that you have that’s preventing you from you know, wanting to take that step and wanting to maybe dive a little kinkier deeper into your relationship and sex life. I think it starts with removing that barrier and removing whatever that wall is that’s preventing you from wanting to do that and then just like going for and owning your horniness and owning who you are and what you want, and getting that orgasm.

 

Damona  24:16  

It’s natural girl it’s natural

 

Unknown Speaker  24:18  

is yes.

 

Damona  24:20  

Yeah. And sometimes you just need to mix things up a little bit. Let’s say you’re on the other side of the conversation and your partner is the one that’s like, let’s be a little bit more adventurous. How do you get to that place where you can go like Dude, should you just go with the flow with what your partner wants to try?

 

Unknown Speaker  24:43  

I think that you should definitely establish beforehand hard boundaries. So anything that you’re absolutely not okay with doing. This can easily be done in something like a yes no maybe list which we actually also included in the book, but we’ve written about it countless times where you And you can print this off. Or you can do it from the book what we included, but there are a bunch of topics that we have listed and you go through with your partner and you say yes, no, or maybe. And if you would rather not do it with your partner, you just like print out a copy, and you do it yourself. And then your your partner does it. And then you compare where all of your yeses are, where all of your maybes are and where all of your nodes are, and the yeses you discuss, like, Yeah, I would be into that. So obviously, like, that’s consenting, once you have a conversation about it, you’re consenting to doing that in the bedroom. That maybe is okay, let’s talk about this. And let’s figure out like, why it’s a maybe and what would make it absolute? Yes. And then the no is a hard boundary, you’re not doing that. So I actually think a yes no, maybe list is maybe the easiest way to transition into like a super sexy thing that you haven’t brought up with your partner, or if you’re part if your partner wants to bring something up to you. But as far as you know, if your partner is just bringing something up, and as long as you don’t, like, have a hard boundary with whatever that person suggested, I say go for it and see if it’s something you’re into, the only way you’re going to know is if you try, and I think you should just completely, like get rid of an idea of, you know, like something that’s taboo and just try it, depending on what your partner brought up.

 

Damona  26:19  

Let’s say you get some of those maybes. And I love that you have this checklist in the book, you get a maybe I’ve also heard from listeners, how awkward it is to have conversations about sex before you’re having sex. Like whether it’s a maybe from that checklist with your existing partner, or like I’m about to have sex with this person, for the first time. How do you bridge those conversations and make them still sexy? Or should you just not even have those conversations when you’re in the bedroom? Should they happen before,

 

Unknown Speaker  26:49  

I do think they should always happen before the bedroom. Like I say consent is the number one thing. So I would always encourage that. But I do understand how that can be like icky, and it looks like you’re just like having a conversation about sex, which makes it so unsexy. But like I said, I think if you’re going to be having sex with someone, you should be able to feel comfortable talking about sex with them. Now, as far as when you’re in the bedroom, I I think what’s really sexy is, you know, doing something and trying something you’re into whether that’s like, I don’t know, like going down their body and saying, Oh, do you like when I touch you like this? Do you enjoy this? Does this feel good? Those types of questions that check in with your partner, make sure that you’re always doing consensual, safe sex, and that your partner is actually into it as much as you are. So I think if you are going to kind of just test the boundaries a little bit, I would always make sure to like, ask, how would you like it if I did this? And, and, you know, does this feel good. And you and that can be sexy. I mean, you’re making out with the first and you’re touching them, you’re on top, and then they’re on top of you, you know, if you just say on a super sexy voice and just let this like animalistic side of you come out that, you know, that’s asking for consent and still being sexy at the same time.

 

Damona  28:04  

What about when you’re in those situations, like I can remember many a time when I was single Taylor, where like, even in a situation where someone was getting consent. There’s sometimes this feeling I’m just gonna like just gonna put it out there and say it sometimes there’s this feeling, it’s like, oh, I don’t really want to do this. But it’s, it’s probably just easier to say us and like get this over with than to actually, like, end it rock the boat or just, you know, just stop the forward motion. You know what I’m saying? I don’t know if you’ve been in that situation, or if you’ve written about any situations like that before, but I think we’re in a new paradigm right now of women. Like, you know, I’m a little bit part of the old guard of like, you know, back then we just like rolled over And we took it. But now like in the conversation of consent, I think there is an element of I don’t want to say responsibility. But I think women are being called to speak up in those moments. And I love it any words of encouragement, you’re such as strong, competent woman like words of encouragement for other women that maybe are in the boat that I was in or that just find it hard to find their voice in those moments.

 

Unknown Speaker  29:20  

I think the biggest thing that I can say to that is that your pleasure is just as much worth it as your partner’s pleasure. So you need to really focus on what feels good to you and not so much what feels good to your partner. I think so often women are told, you know, like you mentioned, we have to lay on our backs and we have to be the one that is making sure the man orgasms or or who whomever their partner is, and and that’s that doesn’t need to be the case our orgasms are just as just as important as our partners. And so if something makes you uncomfy don’t do it You do not have to do it. There’s nothing that says like no you are in charge of a man’s orgasm because you’re not and and i think Like I said, that just goes back to women feeling like they have to please their partner, and they have to focus more on their pleasure. But no, you you deserve an orgasm just as much you need to make sure and like control that, that you are seeking just as much pleasure as you are seeking to give your partner. Okay, and then for

 

Damona  30:17  

our guy spies in the audience, we have a lot of male listeners actually, as well, that one, that they’re good guys tailor, they want to make things also safe and comfortable for women. Are there any tips that you can give those guys for how to create this kind of space? With a new partner?

 

Unknown Speaker  30:41  

Yeah, I mean, I, I’m big on communication, like I said, so I really think that a good good sex starts with communication. And I think it’s just being super open about having a conversation before you have sex about what each other is into and what you want to try, and what feels good. So I would just make sure to actively check in with your partner when you’re having sex to make sure that everything is going great. And and, yeah, I mean, I think sometimes as women we like in heterosexual relationships we like to feel taken care of, and like he’s almost in control. But I don’t think that needs to be the case all the time. So I think having those conversations beforehand can really be beneficial. So I would just tell whoever the guy listeners are that you know, be very open about what you’re interested in and wanting to please your woman and talking to her about what gets her off? Because she knows better than you do.

 

Damona  31:44  

Mm hmm. All right, ladies, no, no best is what they want. We just have to find her voice and speak up about it, and maybe get some new ideas. And I for one got many of them from reading Taylor’s new book, Cosmo, fantasy sex games, y’all. It’s hot, is right for the times. And there’s so much more also at cosmopolitan calm that people can read. And I just have to be you didn’t, you didn’t ask me for this feedback. But I’m just going to give it to you. I’m also a subscriber of for the for the magazine. And I have to say, Taylor, like I know you and I connected because you were looking to highlight some more voices of color. And as I was going through my Cosmo magazine last month, I was really shocked at the number of people who looked like me. And I feel like there’s really been an effort to be as inclusive as possible and to really diversify the images, not just in the content, but also in the advertising. So I just wanted to say how much I really, truly appreciate the work that cosmopolitan is doing on that front,

 

Unknown Speaker  32:59  

of course, and we appreciate experts like you being able to weigh in. I mean, you’ve helped so much with our content. And I hope that all your subscribers know that they can see you on Cosmo articles and be like, yeah, that’s Dimona. She’s awesome. She knows everything. So I love talking to you about the

 

Damona  33:15  

articles. I don’t know if I know everything, but at least I can have conversations with smart ladies like you and we can learn from one another and pass it on. So thank you so much for being here. Taylor, it was really a pleasure to have you on the show.

 

Unknown Speaker  33:28  

Thank you so much. I really appreciate it.

 

Damona  33:31  

Lovers don’t go anywhere. I have your questions. But more importantly, I have your answers. Please stick around. We are back. This is dear demona. This one comes to me from a new listener. In an Instagram dm she says I’m 39 years old and I’ve been on dating apps for 13 years. girlfriend. That’s a long time. She says I haven’t been physical with someone in over three years. But someone asked me to come over Saturday night for drinks, bonfire and sex. And I’m wondering if I should just go for it. I’m worried I’ll catch feelings. Who? That got sexy real fast, didn’t it? First, I would say it’s really good that you know what your tendency is that you know that when you get intimate with someone, you can catch feelings really quickly. First, obviously COVID is happening right now. So you have to have a real way to assess someone’s risk. Like I had a conversation with a client and she was like, Yes, that’s just risk risk. And it was fine to go out on a date and I’m like, I’m not sure how you did that. Like Did you take like, like at the top of the show? Did you do a questionnaire Did you did you like get a saliva sample? Did you stick a swab up his nose? I don’t know. But you figure it out the way that works for your stay and your comfort level how you assess the risk. I think, Hey, we are all feeling the skin hunger right now. Well, not me because I, I’m touched out, I’m around people all day long. But for those of you who are single, it is no wonder that we are missing that human connection, and even just the power of touch. So men or women, there is no shame in getting your physical needs met. But if you know that the tendency for you is to put more into it, and to think more about it than what it really means, you might need to add an extra level of protection for yourself emotionally because it’s clear if this person just matched with you on a dating app. And they were just like, bam, drinks, bonfire, sex, let’s get it on. I don’t know that that is suddenly going to blossom into a more meaningful relationship. So you have to know what you’re signing up for. Now, I’ll tell you a little story. This is kind of embarrassing. I have had one and only one, one nightstand in my life. And I it’s kind of one of those things where I thought, well, everyone’s done it, and everyone should do it. So I’ll just do it and get it over with. And I have to tell you, it was honestly the worst experience of my life, there was nothing sexy about it. I felt terrible when it was over. And he, he wanted to he was really a jerk. And then he wanted to walk me to my car, and I was like, Don’t walk me to my car, I’m fine. I’m a grown woman. And then he felt really bad for being a jerk. So then he just followed me to my car to make sure that I didn’t like I don’t know, get raped or something, because then he’d feel extra bad. And I have to admit, I don’t regret a lot of my experiences. I think every experience that you have, it teaches you something and adds up to something more. So I don’t regret that it happened. But I definitely learned that for me. One Night Stand life was not it. So you might already know that about yourself. But if you feel like you can separate the intimacy and the physical connection, and the sex from the emotional part of it, and you can do it safely. I am not one to judge.

 

Our second question for today came from my women’s group, the dating accelerator program, this person said I met a guy on hinge a few months ago, we’ve had to socially distance dates in person and everything seemed to be going great. We both got really busy at work. But he said if we want to if we want more, we have to see each other more and talk more. I agreed. But since then he’s been distant. I set a date with him for dinner. But when I called him to make a plan he didn’t answer. And he hasn’t called since Should I try again to make this happen? Or is it over. So a lot of times we operate out of a place of assumption. And I definitely think he was trying to send you a message here that he either was angry with something that happened or didn’t feel like he was getting his needs met. And so he he might have even been saying in that conversation, he had already made the decision to move on. If we want more, we’d have to see each other more and talk more. And the other part of that sentence in his mind was, and it doesn’t seem like you can do that. So Peace out, I’m gone. And then at that point, you’re agreeing, but you’re entering from a position of needing to make things up to him and cater to his needs. Right? So I’ll just first say it might already have been too late. But in most of these situations, we also if we don’t have clarity, we need to get clarity. So yes, you should try again. And for some people, like they’re too proud to actually just speak what they are feeling and what they want. And that’s how we end up in all of these ghosting, Limbo, half assed situations, none of that for you, you’re going to say, Listen, I feel like I’ve been really distracted. And I really want to give this a chance. I’d love to see you house this weekend. Just go directly for it. Put your heart out there, put what you want out there, you’re going to get one of two responses. It will either be Oh, I didn’t know that you were really into this? Yes, I’d love to see you. And then he his competence is renewed, and he wants to invest in it further or you get crickets. And what I need you to hear is that crickets are a response. So that’s why I say you might have already gotten the response. But we if you were operating out of a place with any ambiguity, ambiguity, we can’t necessarily judge that. So now you’re going to go right for it. You’re going to say exactly what he wants to hear. You’re going to be very clear about where you See things going in the future. And then you’re going to see what he has to say about it. And then you’re going to report back to me, and the dates and make show. That’s it for today’s episode. This one is 329 of dates and mates. Yeah, you’ve got to check out Taylor’s work and cosmos, she writes all of the hottest content about sex and love and dating@cosmopolitan.com. And this book is seriously, it raised my body temperature, about three or four degrees just from reading it. You can pre order Cosmos fantasy sex games, wherever you get your books, but I’ll put a special amazon link in the show notes. Disclaimer, if you order through this link, I do get a small percentage of the sale like a very, very small percentage of the sale, but I’m just trying to make it easy for you to get this book. So that’s the scoop for today’s episode. Hit me up on the socials at damona Hoffman. I’d love to know what you learned from today’s episode, or hear what your questions are for a future episode. We’ll be back again next week with more hot dates and mates content but in the meantime, make sure you watch the Drew Barrymore show I will be on this Wednesday, September 30. So check your local listings for when you can catch the show. Until next week. I wish you happy dating

 

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

 

Inside OkCupid & VILF

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Love Astrology & Sex Ed

Dating App Hacks & Michelle Obama Says

NYT: How to Revisit Your First Date

Your relationship might be sorely in need of attention. Why not recreate the special day that sparked it, with an enhancement or three?

Rebooting your romance and reigniting that spark are more important than you think, especially now. One way to reconnect with your partner is to revisit your first date. This may sound silly, but the payoff is surprisingly rewarding.

Click here to read Damona’s suggestions, along with other love experts…

Damona’s Algorithm Hacks!

Here are a few key tips on how to making the algorithm work for you:

 

  1. Sign on regularly – daily if you can. If you have notifications turned off you will miss communications plus logging in less frequently tells the app you’re not that engaged and bumps you lower in the search when others are looking for someone like you. 
  2. Initiate messages and swipe liberally – if you don’t swipe or message anyone, the app can’t tell who you want to engage with and will keep matching you more broadly with people you might not actually connect with or find attractive. 
  3. Switch it up – making changes to your profile on regular intervals every month or so means you’re going to the top of the queue regularly 

Click here to get your FREE ALGORITHM HACKS from Damona!

WHOREible Decisions & Cat Guys

WHAT WOULD IT TAKE FOR YOU TO FIND LOVE?

Our guest for today felt like the world would have to end to meet her match. But she’s gone from dating married men and loving her single life to a happy committed relationship… and all it took was a global pandemic to get her there.

Today we’re talking with Mandii B – WHOREible Decisions co-host and multimedia star – about her unexpected journey in love. 

Sit tight ladies and gents, this episode is going to be a FUN one – but a little on the raunchy side. So if your kids are in the car make them do earmuffs or better yet, listen to us later.

There will be some Fbombs, there will be adult talk, but there will also be some intriguing advice and hardcore humor.

First Damona eases you into this show with the dish:

DATING DISH (1:28)

Can you ever truly get over your first love?

According to experts quoted by Elite Daily, there are many psychological reasons that it’s hard to let go of your first love. Damona explains just exactly why and tells you what you have to do to get them off your mind once and for all.

via GIPHY

What’s really going on between the White House sheets?

According to body language experts, Melania is more than unhappy in her marriage to President Donald Trump. Damona breaks it down.

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Should you date a dude with a cat?

News for cat dudes: A new study shows that women have a tendency to rate men who post dating profile pictures with their cat as less desirable. There are limitations to the study, but still, it gives us pause.

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WHOREible Decisions (11:00)

Today Damona sits down with Mandii B aka FullCourtPumps on IG – corporate business boss babe turned into podcast star and entrepreneur! She is one of my favorite women in podcasting. You might have heard me on an episode of her podcast – Whoreible decisions – which she hosts with her friend Weezy.

Mandii is THE ultimate career woman. She’s leveraged her corporate background into one of the most successful podcast careers in the game.

Now she’s here to give us an update on her love life in the time of Corona.

We discuss:

  • Professional women who boss up in their relationships
  • What does it mean to be dominant in your relationship?
  • Dominant women dating dominant men
  • Dating married men
  • It took the end of the world for her to find her perfect relationship

Did you LOVE Mandii as much as we do? Make sure to follow her on all the socials @fullcourtpumps and check out all her podcast projects!

TECHNICALLY DATING (29:40)

Submit your questions Instagram, Twitter, or Facebook and hear our answers live on the show! Here’s what our listeners asked about this week:

  • G – He wants me to be more dominant in the bedroom. I don’t even know where to start?
  • Isaac IG – How should older virgins (25+) go about navigating dating in this pandemic?

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WANT TO GO EVEN DEEPER? HERE IS A TRANSCRIPT OF THE SHOW IF YOU WANT TO FOLLOW ALONG!

Damona 0:00
Hello lovers, I have a special announcement for those of you looking for love. I will be doing a free webinar on Wednesday September 2, all about how to find love in the new normal. Yes, it is possible to meet your match in the middle of a pandemic. And yes, cuffing season is coming and yes, I have the secret to dating and I will share it with you. Why not join me so you know what to do to get out of the dating rat race. You can register for free at the dating secret.com again, that’s th e dating secret.com and you can join me live virtual style for my presentation on how to find love in the new normal and so that you can get your questions answered directly by me. It goes live on September 2 I hope you’ll join me

Unknown Speaker 0:55
is a tale as old as time he’s handsome debonair. She’s pretty and sweet. They lock eyes across the room.

Damona 1:05
Okay, hold on. Honey, you need to get your facts straight. Finding love today is more like Greece posts to get

Unknown Speaker 1:15
somebody to share my life. What is this text me? Maybe he’s just not that into me

Unknown Speaker 1:19
or even I have told all my hoes I got a man I know y’all cheat on your wives, but I’m not gonna cheat on my boyfriend. So I’ll let you know what I’m saying. Okay, you can

Damona 1:26
keep waiting for the fairy tale, or you can get on board with the new rules of relationships. If you’ve read my advice in the LA Times, then you know, this ain’t your mama’s love advice. This is dates and mates with damona Hoffman. Hello lovers, what would it take for you to find love? My guest for today felt like the world would have to end to meet her match. But she’s gone from dating married men and loving her single life to a happy, committed relationship. All it took was a global pandemic to get there. Today we’re talking with Mandy be co host of the hit podcast, horrible decisions and multimedia star about her Unexpected Journey in love. But first, we’ll hit this week’s hot headlines including Can you ever get over your first love? And what’s really going on between the White House sheets according to body language experts, plus, should you date a dude with a cat? Then? At the end of the show, I’ll answer your questions along with Mandy including what to do when your man decides he wants something more in the bedroom and advice for older virgins on navigating the pandemic. Sit tight ladies and gents This episode is going to be a fun one, but a little on the raunchy side. So if your kids are in the car, make them do earmuffs or better yet Listen to us later, there will be some f bombs there will definitely be adult talk. But there will also be some intriguing advice and hardcore humor. First, I’ll ease you into the show with a dish these dating dish.

Elite daily asks, Can you ever get over your first love? Oh, we’ve all had that that first romance those first butterflies. And thanks to the wonders of social media, you can relive them again and again, if you don’t get yourself blocked. Why is it so hard to move on from a first love? Well, for many, it’s the first time that you’ve ever really gotten to be yourself that you’ve stepped out outside of your your home nest and came into your own in the context of a relationship. But according to experts, there are some ways that you can move on from these adolescent or from relationships. You know, it’s funny because one thing they talk about that keeps us tied to the past is thinking about it again and again and again. And I actually have talked on the show about nostalgia, and how effective it is if you’re on a first date to spark feelings of nostalgia and your date to actually create a bonding experience. So asking things like, what did you do for summers growing up? Instead of just being like, hey, how’s your job? Or something like that? Just imagine, like, even me just saying, what did you do for summers growing up, probably made you transported you back to another place. And even if I didn’t have the exact same experience, I can almost connect with you just by thinking about what I did for my summers growing up. But nostalgia. If you’re thinking about a past relationship, it actually can be really dangerous, because there’s this phenomenon that experts refer to as Pollyanna syndrome, and you’re only focusing on positive relationship memory so you don’t forget Get all the fights. You don’t forget the time they lied to you or cheated on you. Well, maybe you remember the cheated, cheating, but you’re not thinking about all of the negative things, all of the friction points in the relationship, you’re you’re taking the Pollyanna approach, and you’re looking at only the optimistic side of the relationship. So how do we fix it? How do we get over that love of the first person we fell for? Well, in this article, this elite daily article, they quoted a couple of doctors doctor, which suggests that getting to the bottom of why you’re having trouble moving forward is really the, at the crux of being able to do that. So you have to ask yourself questions like, how lovable do I feel? And if I don’t feel lovable, what’s getting in the way? And Dr. Wish says until you can really get over that. You won’t be able to move on and when you can get to why didn’t I feel whole or enough from in myself without that relationship? You might have a big life change ahead of you. And it could be something that would make you even more happy than a relationship but certainly more happy than romanticizing the past. Also, Dr. manly quote in this article said, by grieving the first love fully accepting that life has taken a different path and moving forward, the psyche is then open to new possibilities. Obviously, this is a long journey if you’re still thinking about your first love, but you have to take the first step. One person who’s clearly not thinking at all about his first love is Donald Trump. He’s now on wife number three milania, our First Lady of the United States of America, and Nicole Moore, a body language expert has analyzed their relationship. And she tells us according to interview clips and photographs and everything that she’s seen that milania did love Donald at one point, but may not be in love so much anymore. She looked at an interview That milania did in Barbara Walters, I think back in 2015. And she said that the energy of milania changed when she talked about how they first met, going back to the first love and then nostalgia factor, right. She lit up when she was talking about when she first met Donald. But she didn’t seem to be so thrilled about Donald’s presidency. And now, now that she’s in it, she she really doesn’t seem to be so thrilled. And she said she encouraged him to run for president. But according to body language experts and the clues that she’s giving, she may have been lying when she said that. There were also interviews where they asked what

There was also an interview where she was asked point blank if she loved her husband, and you know what she said? She said, Yes, we are fine. That just made me I don’t I’m not a body language expert, but I’m not I don’t think you need one to know that saying yes, we are fine and this is in relation to all of the the affair reports that have come out against Donald to just say yes we are fine is not really answering the question like are you in love with your husband still, so that gives me a little bit of concern. But nothing more so than watching their inauguration first dance. Y’all. I just watched this for the first time. And it is the most cringe worthy moment that I have ever seen. I mean, worse than a middle school dad’s terrible and it’s not even the fact that neither of them could dance and I kept thinking maybe her dress is just too tight. You know when you wear like the, the kind of pencil skirt and and I was like No, there’s plenty of room in that dress for her. Her to dance but she keeps turning her head away. And they’re looking at the crowd and they clearly were the most awkward that they have ever been in the relationship. But now looking at the way that they’re photographed together, he’s definitely taking the lead. He always walks in front of her. I don’t know if you’ve noticed that he always walks in front of her, and he often will initiate conversation. And he, of course will often speak on her behalf. So I can’t predict the future. But I would say based on body language, they have gone through an entire entire lifespan of the relationship. While going through the lifespan of this presidency. I’ll let you check it out. on the list, we’ll put the link to this analysis in the show notes. If you are a fellow looking for love, you might want to think twice about posting a photo with your cat in your dating profile. There was an interesting study that looked at pictures of men themselves and then men holding cats and it turns out she Docker you guys. Turns out that men who are holding cats in photograph seem less masculine, more neurotic and ultimately less dateable. I don’t know why it is that cats gets such a bad rap. But there is something sort of weird about looking at a photo of a super masculine man holding up little fluffy cat. And I really don’t mean to be gender normative or hetero normative or, or feline normative or any of that, but it is sort of funny and people have asked me before do you put your pets in your profile? Do you put cats do you put dogs? Actually, according to the study women who said that they were dog people were the ones that ranked these men, so unfavorably the most unfavorably. So I would say it’s a bit of a gamble. I mean, maybe if your cat is super important in your life, and it’s like Love me love my cat or ever Then I would put it but otherwise you might want to save the cat for the second date. Those are the headlines of this week when we come back. I am going to be with Mandy B aka, full core pumps on IE, she is going to be here talking about her Unexpected Journey and love. She’s also going to dish out a little bit of love and sex advice. And I’m telling you, it’s going to get hot and heavy. So if you’re bothered by some colorful language, this might not be the episode for you. But if you’re up for some fun, definitely keep listening. Welcome back. I’m here with Mandy be also known as full court pumps on Instagram. She’s a corporate business boss babe turned into a podcast star and entrepreneur. She is one of my favorite women in podcasting. You might have heard me on an episode of her podcast horrible decisions, which she hosts with her friend weezy now she’s here to give us an update on her love life in the time of Corona please help me give a big smooches to Mandy

Unknown Speaker 12:09
Hey guys

Damona 12:12
I’m trying to get you on this

Unknown Speaker 12:15
time right it does

Damona 12:16
yes and then when I was on horrible decisions I don’t know if you remember but we talked about doing your dating profile we

Unknown Speaker 12:23
did we did and girl it is unnecessary at this moment

Unknown Speaker 12:30
so what you got to boot up I

Unknown Speaker 12:32
wound up in quarantine of apparently it took the world to end for me to actually find someone I liked. Um so we actually met in the most pandemic fashion possible we met on zoom like

Damona 12:48
what we actually were Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 12:50
we met on zoom through a mutual friend. And literally two days after that, like we exchanged numbers in the in the chat on zoom because he doesn’t Now wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

Damona 13:01
It was like Was it a group like a group zoom party?

Unknown Speaker 13:04
It wasn’t even a group party. No, like a friend of mine was trying to start a podcast. And so he was like, Oh, yeah, well, I think I won’t have my boy on it. So get on and like we got on. I was like, Oh, he kind of fine. And so even started flirting. And then I gave him my contact in the chat because he doesn’t have social media. And we literally went hiking Two days later, and I’ve been inseparable since so. Oh, I know. Right.

Damona 13:34
I love hearing this story. And I’m sure my listeners are sitting there going. Okay, well, that worked for Mandy, but how’s that gonna work for me? Do you have any tips on how you like what was going through your head and how you made it work? Was he

Unknown Speaker 13:51
he was just so fine. And so I was like flirting with him calling him Teddy Riley because he couldn’t get his sound right. So I was just like, I was Pretty much what I mean. And then, um, he like he’s very tall. I like tall men. So as girls do when we flirt, we joke and kind of like to me, I like to really crack jokes. So I was like, hey, so is your head just really big? Or are you a tall person over there? Because, you know, I’m looking at him through a box. And he looks like a huge, a huge guy. But he could have also just had a huge as head on a little body. I don’t know. So when he told me his height, I was like, Well, hello there. How are you? kept flirting? And I’m, like I said, I mean, it happened the same way. I guess you would flirt on a dating app. Like I said, I know we talked about that last time and how to go about like, starting the conversation and letting it know up front what you want. And I think when we exchanged contacts, I didn’t really know what I wanted. It’s funny because as soon as I met him, I was like, Yeah, I just need you know, Dick once a week. I don’t really want to see you that much. I don’t really like People a long time and I just wouldn’t do all these things on on how emotionally unattached I normally am with men and so that I just wanted this. And literally everything I said in the first day is out the window with how I’ve been with him. So

Damona 15:16
do you think he wanted a challenge? Do you think saying those things made him be like, I’m gonna just I don’t even know

Unknown Speaker 15:23
how much of a challenge it was girl I thought as soon as we got back from hiking, so, I mean, there wasn’t much of a challenge. I would say, first day, first day, I mean, I was shit at that point, like three and a half months with no action because of quarantine. And so I was just like, you know, to hell with it. And literally, we ended up seeing each other every day for two months after that. And, and what are his feelings on pegging? Oh, yeah, go for it. It’s so crazy. Yeah, it’s so crazy because he is so dominant. And so for your listeners who may not know I am you bringing up pegging? I guess I’ll open up a little bit here audience. So I am very dominant in the bedroom. I’m very dominant. Like, I’m the type of woman that when I go out to eat even on a date, I’m ordering for the man. So once I know what he wants, when the waiter comes, the man normally doesn’t talk at all. He’ll take this, he’ll take this and I’ll take this. And I’m literally normally that dominant. And so with him, No, ma’am. It I’m in the most submissive state that I think I’ve ever been with a partner. And it’s crazy, because I’ve actually gotten him to like, open up and we go to like the nude beach here in it. Well, it’s in Jersey. And what Wait, what there’s a new jersey shore? Yeah. Well, Cindy gunnison. And it’s funny because I was talking to my friend GLAMAZON tile me shout out to her, and I was like, oh my god. I’m so submissive. He doesn’t let me be dominant. And what’s crazy is he opened up he was like, actually When we go to the beach, and when you bring me to places, that’s you in a dominant state, he was like, I’m literally allowing you to take me into the spaces that you feel comfortable in. And he was like, so I’m vulnerable in that state, like all of these new places and new things that you’re showing me. That’s a form of me allowing your dominance as well. And I was like, Oh, you just go worse. I’m talking about the bedroom. But no, it was. So like, I think that he actually does feel a sense of vulnerability and submissiveness when he allows me to kind of take the lead. So you know, there’s a balance.

Damona 17:36
Yeah, it’s nice. That’s actually that’s a, you said in a very raw way. That’s really beautiful. That’s really beautiful that you can allow him to be vulnerable in his way and that you can be you can find your vulnerability as well. I imagine it must be a little different, too, because he came in knowing that you had this podcast horrible decision.

Unknown Speaker 17:57
Not really and no,

Unknown Speaker 17:58
no, no.

Unknown Speaker 18:00
He didn’t know until the end of the cabinet gonna hold him, literally. So what’s crazy is he knew of the podcasts. And the only reason he knew of the podcast was because he was like, yeah, so I was in Jamaica, and I went on Google and found the podcast. And I was like, sir, you’re not slick. You. If you were looking while you were in Jamaica, you came across our hedonism episode. hedonism is the swingers resort in Jamaica. So I was like, Oh, you bought that life, huh? And so I kind of open it. But yes, he actually saw that episode and thought I was approved. He was like, Oh, so y’all didn’t even have sex there. Like he was like, I watched the whole episode and I thought both of y’all just weren’t as freaky as y’all. Y’all made it out to be. So yeah, he Wow.

Damona 18:47
That was I think you found the right guy. I think you found that guy and girl. But on the show, you really talk in a in a very, in a very open way about sex about Gender roles about sexuality, gender identity, all that stuff. And I think it must have been, what was that moment? Because you also came from a corporate? Yes. You and weezy, right? Yes. And here you are doing this very. If I may say kind of x rated podcast, right. While you’re also still working your corporate job for a while. Yeah, I mean, now this is your thing is

Unknown Speaker 19:25
my main job now. I mean, of course, I did feel like I was living two different lives. I mean, I’m sure they thought I was sick as hell because I would have to leave work to go to the studio and I was like, Oh, my God, I have a doctor’s appointment. So I don’t know how many times I use doctor’s appointment while I was at work, but I was like,

Damona 19:41
you were knocked out. That’s why I do I’m gonna

Unknown Speaker 19:44
count. I was an accountant for a big four firm. So like during tax season, I’m in the office till two o’clock in the morning. But like if I had to go to the studio, I was like, oh, tonight can’t be one of those nights I stay late. And they definitely you know, pin that against me especially in review time because They thought I wasn’t saying as late as I should have been. Um, but what’s crazy, I think that that’s where our audience grew as well, just because I worked corporate just because I have two degrees just because, you know, I’m in that kind of conservative setting as well. You know, I could even show my tattoos. I think that a lot of our audience resonated because when they go home, they suck dick to you know what I mean? On the weekends, they’re going out, and they’re hoping for a one night stand after they go to the club and meet a guy that, you know, puts them into a pretzel. So it’s, it’s, it’s funny because you call it x rated. But really, we just talk about, literally sex in a way that I think a lot of people are ashamed of saying, but we all do these things. You know what I mean? I mean, is everyone pegging? No. But I was

Unknown Speaker 20:53
like, I don’t know. Maybe I don’t know.

Unknown Speaker 20:57
But you know, like, even though

Damona 20:58
it’s aspirational in a way

Unknown Speaker 21:00
Yeah, there we go. Like a lot of people say they literally live their lives through hearing our stories. And I love that. And I mean, even when we were on tour, people were saying we change their relationships, because now they found ways to communicate with their partners. And even if both of them just listened to the episode, we talked about topics that maybe you wouldn’t even think to bring up to your partner. But because you’re listening you could just literally blame us if you want to peg your man. Just be like, Hey, I heard this crazy shit on this podcast. What are your thoughts? And then now you have the conversation open to that you know?

Damona 21:33
Yeah, and you you make it so fun the dynamic between the two of you is just so honest your friends before he started the podcast, right?

Unknown Speaker 21:41
No, yeah, like so we’ve known each other since we went Didn’t she

Damona 21:45
go to it like a guy no appointment with

Unknown Speaker 21:47
me. So that was actually upon us like getting back into good graces we actually became, we started off actually as enemies because I dated her ex This is mind you 15 years old, so doesn’t really count. It’s a boyfriend. That never counted. And so we ended up being becoming friends around 1516. And we have a wild crazy traveling party liquor infused just rock star type of friendship up and through about 20 years old. And then we stopped being friends for about five years, somehow prior to the legal. We were definitely under age drinking, absolutely with fake IDs and all. But say like, we ended up parting ways for about five years. And just the way the universe has things set up. She ended up in New York A few years after I moved here. And so a lot of our mutual friends were just like, Oh, we these moving to New York, you guys should meet up, you know, at this point. Now, we’re 2526 years old. A lot of things have changed. We’re both now you know, I’m in college, literally working at Goldman Sachs at the time, she’s you know, upping the ranks in her tech job and so We were like, Okay, let’s try this again, literally a month. Within rekindling, we ended up in the studio and started horrible decisions. And here we are three and a half years later

Unknown Speaker 23:11
doing this full time story. Yeah.

Damona 23:14
And you’ve been through a lot of changes even personally through the course of doing the show. And you’ve always been very body positive. Yes. You know, you share bikini shots on Instagram.

Unknown Speaker 23:28
I think at this point, I own a goddamn bikini line.

Unknown Speaker 23:32
I mean, you wouldn’t think I live in New York.

Unknown Speaker 23:35
You see me in a bikini. Right? I know. Right?

Damona 23:39
Right. Right. But also your body has changed during that time. So you and you actually had surgery. Yes,

Unknown Speaker 23:46
I had you had the so I had the gastric sleeve. VSG it’s the vertical sleeve. So basically, they took out 80% of my stomach. And this isn’t to be confused with life. Whoa, this is literally my organ my stomach went from literally the size of a flattened football to a to a golf ball. And so it’s pretty much a forced portion control as far as food is concerned, and literally the first three months of it was like a liquid only than soft food only then blended food only because my stomach was stapled shut. And so yeah, literally within a year and a half, I went to my peak of about 230 pounds, all the way down to about 155. So about 80 pounds. And I mean, also to put into perspective as well. I’m five foot one. So 230 pounds on someone who’s five one, you know, is is kind of a lot and so there was a lot as far as how I felt in the bedroom. I felt like my partner’s had a lot to say. There were a lot of uncomfortable conversations as well. Where you’re saying before you had

Damona 25:01
this? Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 25:03
Well, even with people knowing about my surgery like I mean, at one point, when I started losing weight, my my lovers at the time because I had multiple, they were like, Oh, we gotta we gotta get you some food. They actually liked my way I had other men that was like, Oh, well let me let me have sex with you before the weight loss. And what’s crazy is there’s there’s such shame and stigma surrounding bigger women in dating, not only for men, but women as well. And what’s crazy is a lot of these men did not want me to lose these pounds. But also, you know, there’s stigma and if we get into the talks about how they view lizzo and how they view a lot of just bigger girls in the industry, we almost come across as we’re not the type of people that men would fuck, essentially. And what’s crazy is I feel like I was getting way more men when I look bigger. Not gonna lie. To me now you just got that one. I do. Just have And I’d never thought that I’d be the one to be like, like I’ve always said that I need a boyfriend who’s gonna let me keep all my hopes. And I literally have told on my hose now like, Hey, I got a man. I know y’all cheat on your wives, but I’m not gonna cheat on my boyfriend. So I’ll let you know what I’m saying again.

Damona 26:19
Oh, wait a minute, you just you just here we go. You just dropped something there that I have to pick up. So So you’ve been the other woman? A lot? A lot. What at? What does that feel like for you?

Unknown Speaker 26:35
I’ve started thinking about it psychologically, as to why I prefer these relationships. And I mean, for anyone listening who’s married, they’re just probably going to be like, Oh, fuck, whatever you have to say about this. Like, you’re an awful woman to do so. But I’ll be honest, I feel like if it’s not me, it’ll be someone else. First off. Secondly, I don’t go into it. with malice, I don’t go into it wanting to steal away this man from their wives. I honestly normally don’t know the wives name, the birthday, their relationship, we don’t talk about it. But I’ve gotten into more thinking as to why I like these relationships. And here’s, here’s the fact of the matter. When dating a married man, I can be 100% myself, when dating while being single. I think as a woman, you lose yourself because you’re trying to be wiped or cuffed or become the girlfriend. And a lot of times you go about doing things, thinking, This is what I need to do in order to become a wife with this man. So I’m going to change who I am to do so in the relationships that I have with these married men. It’s been just the most honest and organic relationship because I know exactly what they want out of me and, and vice versa. And so we’re able to be honest, the lies that you would normally Tell somebody that you’re trying to pursue don’t have to be there. Because clearly there’s another woman. And so it’s honestly just become some of my most honest and fulfilling relationships over the last decade.

Damona 28:12
And you’re really living in the moment and those really you

Unknown Speaker 28:14
are and you can just say, Mr. Chair, so whatever stress they’re having, as far as you know, the financials of a marriage or being parents in a marriage, when I’m with them, and they’re with me, it’s, it’s not really a thing. And I will be honest, too, like, I’ve benefited financially through those relationships. I’m not getting them, you know, just to say, Hey, I have a married boyfriend, husband, whatever. No, like normally it’s, it’s financially beneficial to me. And it is, I guess, emotionally. You know, an advantage for them. And it’s just, it’s just fun. I mean, I’ve enjoyed it and they’ve looked out for me more than anyone has I just, like knowing what I’m getting into and I think with dating and being single you It’s all up in the fucking air

Damona 29:02
is but you must have had some experiences. so crazy experiences with the wife finding out or stalking you or whatever. No, never. Um,

Unknown Speaker 29:13
I’ve had one that’s like so they’ve all told me that they’ve been questioned about me. But I’m a friend. And they’re that. So like, it’ll go to where maybe we just make sure we don’t look like we’re in the same cities at certain times on social media wise, but other than that, like no, it’s never been like a difficult thing. I’ve never called the house. I’ve never made it awkward.

Damona 29:41
Wow.

Unknown Speaker 29:42
Okay, well as a wife, I don’t know that. I know. I know.

Damona 29:45
I don’t know I can cosign on that. But maybe you should do like a class for the women that do.

Unknown Speaker 29:51
You also have a new podcast. You may not know busy busy, and this is only two I have a third one dropping in two weeks. So I

Damona 30:00
So the new one I was talking about is period. Yes. And tell us about what that is. So

Unknown Speaker 30:07
I think with the three and a half years that we’ve been doing a horrible, a part of horrible that I love although Yes, we talk about all of the nasty, kinky things involving sex. I really enjoy learning about just the body, psychologically how things happen. We’ve had a lot of experts come on, and I just love hearing stories about how other people maneuver their lives and and you know, so with period says, I wanted a platform to focus on women. I am I have so many home girls, and I actually blame them as to why I’ve been single so long. Because when I have free time, I just want to hang around my home girls, I love my friends. And I mean, of course, we always talk about so many different things. And it’s just crazy that so many women experienced so many different things. And people just assume that we all go through the same course in life and, and and I’m just like not at all. And so I started period CES to go into just all of the things that women go through. So some of the topics include pcls, infertility, trying to conceive after birth control, breastfeeding, single parenting, co parenting, I’m doing one on body positivity, of course and loving your curves I talked about. I talked with my friend Latasha about loving her dark skin and her coarse hair, and how society has deemed those features to be not beautiful. And so literally just opening the dialogue with so many women on on how they live through life and it’s, it’s so rewarding. I just, it’s been so fulfilling and recording and getting that content out there.

Damona 31:50
I’m so glad that you’re doing it. Yeah. I and I love that you have found love since the last time that we had a hand in that Mandy But I think it’s really exciting to just see all the changes that have happened in all of these changes happening through quarantine. I was gonna say

Unknown Speaker 32:09
for the, for me to find happiness Jesus, right, but

Damona 32:13
you know what it did it. It caused us to flip our perspective

Unknown Speaker 32:17
and currency and I got a fucking cat because I was so lonely. Okay, so

Unknown Speaker 32:21
you got a cat, you got a boyfriend, you got two

Unknown Speaker 32:24
podcasts and I actually see boxes behind here I actually, quarantine allowed me to sit my ass down and I was like, there’s no reason why I still don’t have a product. And so I am actually also periods. This is a part of the official box owner brand and it’s a subscription box that focuses on bringing women own and black owned feminine hygiene and sexual wellness products to your front door. And so I’m partnering with a lot of brands who may not have the the capacity to get on shelves, or be in Target or Walmart. Finding a way to help bring those brands into your home.

Damona 33:04
That is so exciting. I am definitely gonna get my boss

Unknown Speaker 33:07
salutely

Damona 33:08
and when you come out with that bikini line, right, you let

Unknown Speaker 33:11
me know.

Damona 33:13
Alright, we’re gonna take a short break, but I want you to stick around because we have a lot of questions that are more in the horrible, horrible decisions kind of category. Data meets category and you are the woman to answer those. d damona. Help me. We are back with Mandy from horrible decisions. And Mandy Yes, let’s do it. Love your advice. So let’s help some ladies and some Jen. I love that. Get their loving in quarantine. This one comes to us from Gina on Twitter. She says he wants me to be more dominant in the bedroom. I don’t even know where to start. Mandy How can Gina become a boss?

Unknown Speaker 33:56
Oh Boss Lady. I mean dominance is different for A lot of people, to me, it’s what it’s putting them in a vulnerable state, which is probably why I like the pegging in the booty play so much, because those are normally no go places to go. I mean, I think something up, the way to dominate, I think would be as easy as starting with a massage. Maybe blindfolding them, adding some different toys and layers into the bedroom. But you literally being like, hey, tonight, we’re going to try something new. That’s the way to be dominant, because now you’re taking lead. And it’s literally that simple. You say? Yes. Yes, that simple. So you taking the lead in the bedroom, and being like, hey, I want to introduce you to something new. And we talked about that earlier. Literally just being the person to lead allows you to have that dominance. And so it can be something as simple as that and now you’ve opened the, you know, conversation to maybe he wants to try something else and you take that lead and introduce them to those things.

Damona 35:00
Yeah, I love that. And I also read a study about how people are more open to trying new things during the pandemic. Now, it’s like, yeah.

Unknown Speaker 35:13
They’re like, wait, I realized there’s a few things I want to try before I leave this earth. That’s why

Damona 35:19
I also bored. Like, if you’re at home all the time, and you’re there with your partner all the time, you’re just like, well, we might as well do something out and

Unknown Speaker 35:26
try some new things in quarantine. And I didn’t even think there was anything new for me to try. So yes, I think it is wrong. I think the world Yes, but yes, please like,

Damona 35:37
She’s also already in a relationship. And I think a relationship should be based around trust and you should be able to try new things and know like, what’s the worst that’s gonna happen? Right? I mean, maybe a trip to the hospital, I don’t know. Right? But if you’re with your partner, he there shouldn’t be any shame or embarrassment or grief. There’s somebody that you really trust and can open up to. Okay, I have another one for you from Isaac on instant He says, How should older versions 25 plus go about navigating dating in this pandemic?

Unknown Speaker 36:08
Well, the way I lost my virginity at 16 I don’t even I don’t know how to really help with that, um, to me.

Unknown Speaker 36:18
To me, I mean, I guess you could maybe talk about maybe talk more to the dating profile in it. Um, you being a virgin, I think has more to do with maybe you wanting that emotional or whatever type of attraction outside of sexual. And so, I don’t know, I would say to just bring up that conversation. I still think maybe he’s looking for something more serious before he loses it. And to me and quarantine actually, now is the best time because people are sitting the fuck down. So you probably actually have more time to get to know somebody before diving into sex.

Damona 36:52
Yeah, you have to get over that covid hurdle of is this person right? safe to even be around to even be around right and then once you’re in You’re in no pun

Unknown Speaker 37:03
intended I want intended

Damona 37:05
no intended intended. Um, I will say I feel like when I was ready I was just like, let’s just let’s just get it done. And we put so much emphasis on the first time especially as you get older you start thinking like it has to be a certain thing it has to be really special and it has to be candlelight and magic and sometimes you just need to you know, I’m now I’m speaking to women but you know, Papa cherry and get it done and then move on tonight

Unknown Speaker 37:36
just talks about this. I don’t think I realized how much bad sex I was getting until I actually realized Okay, more about myself and experiencing good sex. And what’s crazy is I talked about even because I lost my eight my virginity, as you know, in my teens, I realize how quick my body count added up to because I was Looking for that hi that loving basketball first time moment that made me feel special and actually felt good. And the first couple times you have sex, you’re gonna be like, this is it? This is the Big Bang Really? And so yeah, it’s I mean, to me I think if you’re a virgin it’s also to me at this age smart for you to figure out what you enjoy. Do you like your balls played with? Do you want some math play and really start exploring yourself so that you are able to communicate with your partner the things that you’re gonna like?

Damona 38:32
sales of toys are up in nature and there’s maybe your third business there’s a third Oh my god. This quarantine keeps going on just like

Unknown Speaker 38:43
the at home toys buyer. We go.

Damona 38:44
Oh, ideas, ideas, that one’s for you. Okay, one last question before you have to go Mandy this one. I think this one came to us in an email Leo Tell me later and I’ll do a pickup. This person says what if you find someone that you would like to see Dark a committed physical relationship with how do you navigate and set safety agreements. You just went through this Oh, and slept with them on the

Unknown Speaker 39:08
first year. You know what I mean? Um, but it’s hard. You know, he was COVID free. Well, how did you know his status? He wasn’t coughing. I don’t know. I mean,

Unknown Speaker 39:18
honestly, I mean, I would hope I mean, this is I mean, giving the human species way too much credit. But I would hope that it’s something to where if you don’t feel well, you know, just not to bring your ass around people. And again, that’s probably giving people way too much credit. Because we have seen a lot of people just pretty much out in the open like, Yeah, I got COVID but I wanted to go to the beach. There are those selfish individuals. But I think it’s funny. You’ll know if that person is the right person for you. There was a person that I had been having sex with, I think we talked about him. I had been bugging him for seven years. The guy 24 seven, who’s no longer in the picture. It was there in Quincy. And we ended up reaching out to each other. And he actually was offended that I asked him if he had any symptoms or was COVID free or had tested positive. And he made it seem like I was asking him if he had HIV. Now this was early on, this was like, in March or April, like right in the midst locked down, but it’s like, he got offended that I asked him if he was healthy. And so I think that you opening that, that dialogue with whoever you’re wanting to seek that physical interaction with? You need to make it to where you guys can not only talk about COVID in this space, but hey, are you fucking anyone else Ross Should I know like, you know, when was the last time you got tested? I think that this actually opens up the dialogue to the important questions. If you’re going to go forward with having sex with someone and literally open up about all things you get tested for everything. You know what I mean? I just

Damona 40:50
think it’s a it’s an open that up. Yeah. What about though going forward into the relationship now you’re a little ways into it. Is it an ongoing agreement that If you are bringing someone into your bubble, that they’re not going out and going to parties or having a different risk level than you Oh,

Unknown Speaker 41:07
I mean, I’m not gonna hold you my man didn’t pretty much asked me if I was chasing Corona. Because I’ve been on I mean, I’ve been to Atlanta twice. I’ve been to Florida, I’ve been to LA. And so you just figure out where Corona is poppin

Unknown Speaker 41:21
and then, you know, that’s,

Unknown Speaker 41:24
like, so you just want to go to all the epicenters. Hmm. And, um, to me, it’s and that’s why like, even when I go to those places, I’m not going to a Hookah Bar, I’m not going to clubs, I am being around my friends. Even when I was just in LA, my home girl was like, I don’t feel too well. And I said, Well, I love you, but Honey, I’m not gonna see you. Like, if you’re not feeling well. This is not the time to be around your friends with a cold or anything you know. And honestly, just getting tested, like I’m scheduled to get tested next week. Just so that he knows my results and just so that we can like be on top of it and Yeah, again, it’s the conversation you have to at the end of the day, we’re all not living in our own little bubbles anymore. People are back to work. People are back eating out, they’re at the gyms. I mean gyms opened up here in New York this week. So, wow.

Unknown Speaker 42:14
Yeah, I mean, it’s

Unknown Speaker 42:16
a lot of kids are back to school, you have to realize this bubble that we were living in maybe in April and May. It’s kind of bursted and so you just have to be do your due diligence, wear your masks, do your hand sanitizer, and if you don’t feel well stay away from people until you get tested.

Damona 42:34
There you have it take responsibility for your life and those around you take control of your sexuality and what you need in the bedroom to and definitely definitely check out horrible decisions. And oh, periods. Yes, definitely check out periences and you’ll let us know when these new prod these this new buy.

Unknown Speaker 42:55
Box is dropping in September. So in the next couple of weeks The website will launch anyone can can join up for the subscription or the mailing list. It’ll have a newsletter component to it as well. And again every Monday, if you’re not, you know if you actually like this little raspy voice that you just listened to for the last hours, though, it’s we I released both shows on Mondays so you can listen to horrible decisions and get your kink in comedy. And then head over to period sis and get some edutainment tales of womanhood.

Damona 43:30
I love it. I love it. Make sure you follow make sure you follow me on Instagram, every little court pump and Mandy even though I didn’t get a chance to do your dating profile, I got a man now girl. I’m so happy that you found love and continue to track your journey and hopefully you can come back on dates and mates and tell us more. Yes,

Unknown Speaker 43:51
thank you so much for having me.

Damona 43:53
This has been Episode 325 of dates and maids. You can follow Mandy on all of the social At full court pumps, we’ll put the link in the show notes, of course, but make sure you stay tuned on all of her latest updates. There is definitely some tea coming down the pike. So you’re going to want to know what’s happening with Mandy because she has big news to share, and just a few weeks, and as always, we will give you a shortcut to today’s headline articles and the best gifts in the game. On the show, recap at dates and mates.com. Don’t forget that registration is now open for my free webinar that’s happening this Wednesday on September 2, so don’t miss out. Sign up at the dating secret.com again, th e dating secret.com and I will share the secret with you. In the meantime, hit me up on your favorite social platform at damona Hoffman. DM me, let me know what you liked from this week’s episode. And let me know what questions you have that I could answer on a future show. We We’ll be back again next week with a deep dive on dating app algorithms to kick off your labor day. Until then, I wish you happy dating

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

Zoom Date Tips & Tik Tok for Lovers

TIPS FOR YOUR ZOOM DATE

Hello Lovers! Are you having a hard time connecting over your zoom date? You’re not alone.

As we embrace the new normal I want to make sure you have all the tools and tips you need to make a connection in the most disconnected time in history. Zoom Dates might just be our only option right now.

Last year I talked to Susan Ibitz – The Human Behavior Hacker – who told us how to read faces on dating apps to choose your match just based on what their facial features reveal about them. Now we brought her back to help us level up our dating skills for the new system of online dating, zoom dates, and social distance dates with masks.

What can you infer about someone from your first Zoom date?

How can you tell someone’s facial expression with the ability to only see their eyes?

What kind of facial qualities would indicate the right match for you?

Susan is going to give us the scoop on the scientific shortcuts to human behavior that are written all over your face.

But first we have to talk about this week’s headlines:

DATING DISH (1:28)

The latest dating trap:

“Woke fishing:” What is it? Are you in danger?

Tik Tok for Lovers

Tik Tok brought together two lovers, Natalie and Josaiah. While historically we’ve been cautious about mixing social media and dating, it’s shaping up to be a big part of coronadating.

Mama Yenta? Is that you?

New dating app JustKibbutz has the best take of the week on dating apps: “Do you really think an algorithm knows you better than your own mutha?!?”

Zoom Date Tips (11:00)

Today Damona spoke with Susan Ibitz, a longtime professional in face reading and behavior hacking. You might remember her from an episode last fall where she taught us how to analyze your dating app matches using the same tactics she’s used to negotiate hostage situations for the police. 

Today, Susan and Damona teamed up to use those same human behavior hacking skills to teach you how to show up for your COVID style dates.

We discuss:

  • the importance of good mics
  • Hands!
  • Camera positioning
  • The importance of backgrounds
  • Zoom date and self esteem
  • Anna Ferris was right: The eyes really are the nipples of the face.

Did you know that Susan did some more personal human behavior hacking and set up one of our daters for real success? You can find the video on Patreon!

TECHNICALLY DATING (29:40)

Submit your questions Instagram, Twitter, or Facebook and hear our answers live on the show! Here’s what our listeners asked about this week:

  • Em on IG- She’s having some trouble reading herself these days. She’s 26 and online dating and she’s feeling like she’s ready to meet someone to start her life with this is what I’m says the past few people I’ve been talking with and dating are really sweet and easy to talk to. But I’m not feeling attracted to them once I meet them. Even after a few or several dates. I’m trying to figure out if it’s just that I’m not ready to be dating right now. Or if the person or these people are not the right match for me or do I just need to keep putting myself out there for new matches?
  • Jocelyn on IG – She says she’s a single 41 year old nurse working in a hospital with potential exposure to Corona virus on a daily basis. She says I have to work hard to keep myself safe and healthy. But obviously some risk still exists. It’s a it’s difficult for many healthcare providers to get tested. She says she’s never been tested and doing so on a regular and ongoing basis is unrealistic for her totally get that. She’s seen very few people and would be okay accepting a man into her bubble. But she says she’s only interested in so as careful as she is, is it hypocritical of me as a nurse to ask for this level of caution

What is Patreon?

Patreon is a platform that allows you to support creators like me to keep making helpful content that you want to hear and allow you to get amazing listener benefits by participating

Our page is Patreon.com/datesandmates

What will you get if you sign up?

There are three different tiers. One for our loyal listeners who want to connect with others and keep this show going strong for another 7 seasons.

Sign up at patreon.com/datesandmates for: 

  • an opportunity to work with Damona directly
  • to get quality advice that is tailored to your dating challenges
  • and to become part of a community that will help you find the healthiest, most loving relationships this year

WANT TO GO EVEN DEEPER? HERE IS A TRANSCRIPT OF THE SHOW IF YOU WANT TO FOLLOW ALONG!

Unknown Speaker 0:00
It’s a tale as old as time. He’s handsome, debonair. She’s pretty and sweet. They lock eyes across the room.

Damona 0:10
Okay, hold on. Honey, you need to get your facts straight. Finding love today is more like

Unknown Speaker 0:17
we supposed to get my swipe. I don’t want

Unknown Speaker 0:19
somebody to share my life. What does this text mean? Maybe he’s just not that into me or even

Damona 0:31
you can keep waiting for the fairy tale, or you can get on board with the new rules of relationships. If you’ve read my advice in the LA Times, then you know, this ain’t your mama’s love advice. This is dates in mates with damona Hoffman

Hello lovers, welcome. Well COVID just keeps on trucking. And so do we over here at dates and mates as we embrace the new Normal, I want to make sure that you have all the tools and tips you need to make a connection in the most disconnected time in human history, or maybe the most connected depending on how you view technology. Last year, I talked to Susan ebbetts, the human behavior hacker, who told us how to read faces on dating apps to choose your match just based on what their facial features reveal about them. Now, I brought her back to help us level up our dating skills for this new system of online dating, virtual dates and social distance dates with masks Of course, what can you infer about someone from your first virtual date? How can you tell someone’s facial expression with the ability to only see their eyes? What kinds of facial qualities would indicate the right match for you? Susan is going to give us the scoop on the scientific shortcuts to human behavior that are written all over your face. But first to hop over to the headlines, including woke fishing, what is this latest dating term? And how do you look out for it? And Mama yenta could your mother be a better matchmaker for you? Plus, is tik tok the way to your heart? I’ll tell you how to make a meaningful connection on social media. Then, at the end of the show, I’ll answer your questions including how do you date during COVID as a medical professional, and 26 and online dating without any real attraction? Is it you? Or is it this new method of meeting people? All right, get your pen and paper ready because this is going to be one of those study session types of episodes that you will want to take notes for. And we will begin at all with the dish

Unknown Speaker 2:46
these dating dish.

Damona 2:48
You know I love a good dating term and the online mag the tab has brought us up to speed on woke fishing. This is when a guy says he’s feminist and anti rape But turns out not to be the jury’s still a little bit split on whether this is something intentional, if this is actually a phishing situation, or this is just something where he thinks that he has more liberal beliefs than he actually does. Because, you know, it’s I guess it’s hip to be progressive right now. And they realize that a lot more women are trending this way. And so to get in with them, they might present themselves as Oh, so woke, but not really being supportive things like Black Lives Matter. Or they might just slip up on a racial slur. I heard a story from a listener not that long ago that dated a guy for a year and a half. She’s biracial and discovered that the guy she’s dating actually isn’t so into black people.

It’s a complicated web we weave out there, but you want to be on the lookout for people trying to be overly sympathetic. To your views or to overreach on things that they don’t appear to know anything about. We’re all in a place right now where this is new learning for so many of us. And if we can just stay in that place of discovery, you don’t have to be so woke to be so dateable. But just be yourself and be open to listening and learning. If you’re looking for love, and maybe you’re afraid to get and woke fished on a dating app. BuzzFeed told us about a cute story of a couple that met on tik tok. And it went viral. And let me tell you, I learned a lot. And I think there’s a lot that you could take away from this couple and how you might be able to make a connection via social media, right? We can’t go to bars anymore. We can’t just be wiling out in the streets. But you can actually be really strategic about who you meet using social media. All right, this couple I’ll tell you, Natalie and Josiah. They met by a typical A post that Josiah made. I have to tell you, I totally didn’t get it. It was like about him dropping a fry in the car and like how you never see it again. Anyways, I’ll let you see him. I’ll put the link to the BuzzFeed article in the show notes, but she it made her laugh. It doesn’t have to make me laugh. It kind of goes back to that point. I always say with a sense of humor. Everybody wants someone with a good sense of humor but what one person finds funny and what another person is cannot believe that you wasted countless hours creating are two very different things but Natalie was charmed by it. And let me tell you what she did. Instead of just engaging with him on tik tok. She went a level deeper. she searched for him on Instagram, and then she followed him on Instagram and liked a few of his other photos. Pro tip that I learned from producer Leo, it’s considered polite if you follow someone to go through and like some of their photos. If you’re following me on Instagram at damona, Hoffman, maybe go through and like a couple of my posts, so I know what you’re responding to. But it also can signal interest. And clearly that’s what happened with Natalie and Josiah. Because then he started following her back. And then they started chatting. And then they went on this cross country road trip, and it was Oh, so cute. You can read the story there. But I want to give you some tips on how to have your own social media meet cute. So the first thing is search for hashtags that are relevant to you. If there’s a particular show that you’re interested in or something like I was saying that indicates your sense of humor sensibility interest that you have, check out that hashtag see who’s talking on on that thread. You can also search for interesting comments on other profiles that you follow and see who might be cute and might be interesting. to chat with just through that particular thread or on that particular page, and see where it can go from there. Then of course, if you like, and he likes, and then you like additional photos, and then you’re following each other, you have a direct line to the DM. Another much underutilized resource is the Facebook group. And there are several groups like I’m in a bunch of podcasting, Facebook groups love coaching professional Facebook groups, you know, political interest, Facebook groups, whatever it is that you’re into, the weirder the better, I would say, but if you can search for a group that fits that particular interest or value system, and then become active in the group, don’t just be a looky loo, actually actively comment and engage with other people in the group that are cute. And start making yourself visible. I talk about this a lot in my dating program. That you, you have to be out there you have to be visible in order to be found. So if you are initiating posts, and you are also commenting on other people’s posts one, you’re going to be boosted in the algorithm. We’ll talk about algorithms next episode. So don’t get ahead of ourselves, but it will make you more visible to others and it will make your posts be shown higher up the next time you post. And you can get seen by those kinds of people that you want to meet. One thing just make sure your account makes it very clear that you’re single, none of this single shame. You’ve heard me talk about that last season. I’m continuing on season eight, no single shame. You’re single, you’re ready to mingle. You don’t have any pictures of exes. In your profile. You don’t have anything that’s that’s vague about what your relationship status is. You’re on Facebook, you can say straight up. I’m single and I’m looking to meet men, women, whatever it is, so be bold. Be clear about it and take a chance you never know you might make a match. If you still feel like you haven’t found a match in today’s world, maybe you should just ask your mom, the Atlanta Jewish times told us about a new app that will launch this fall called just kibitz. That allows Jewish moms to be yentas for their kids. Fun fact, I almost called my my sight Sister yenta when I first launched this, for those of you who don’t know, I’m both black and Jewish, so it’s fitting for me, but it’s probably fitting for some of these moms. And when I originally started as a writer for JD, I used to get a lot of moms that were like, Can I just do this for my kid? Can I just set them up on dates? Can you help me help them? So this allows moms to be mom masters and set their children up on dates. Here’s a really funny part. They asked this sample selection of people would they go out on a date set up by their mom and only 50% of them said that they would. And then they said, Well, what if the date was prepaid? What if mama pays for it? 92% of them were like, sure, then I could go out with somebody. So I’m interested to see how just kibitz works. And they have an interesting slogan. They have an interesting CEO named Jeffrey Kaplan, who said, other dating sites are investing in algorithms and artificial intelligence. You really think a robot knows you better than yo and mother. That’s much sugar. Our site is powered by maternal intelligence. I love it and I whether you have a Jewish mom or not, I think this is a really interesting turn on the online dating landscape. Those are the headlines for this week. Before the break, I have a special announcement for those of you who are looking for love and want to hear more of the kind of tips that I just gave in the dating dish. I’m going to be doing a free webinar. On September 2, all about how to find love in the new normal. Yes, it is possible to meet your match in the middle of a pandemic. Yes, cuffing season is coming. And yes, I have the secret to dating and I will share it with you. So why not join me so you know what to do to get out of the dating rat race and get on to that relationship of your dreams. You can register for free at validating secret calm again, that’s th e dating secret.com. We’ll be live on September 2. And I’d love to meet you virtual style. Of course, you can check for the link in the show notes. I hope to see you there. Welcome back. As I mentioned at the top of the show today I spoke with Susan Ive it’s a longtime professional in face reading and behavior hacking. You might remember her from an episode last fall where she taught us how to analyze your dating app matches using the same tactics. She’s used to negotiate hostage situations. For the police. While today Susan and I team up to use the same human behavior hacking skills to teach you how to show up for your COVID style dates. Here she is giving me a list of her biggest zoom date tips on sound, hand gestures and camera position.

Unknown Speaker 12:20
From all the things that you need to invest, invest in a good microphone, the boys is really important. Why we’re really boys with calm. One tip the most people forget show your hands. If you put in the camera to highs like you looking down on me and that is not a good first impression. So make sure the cameras in 90 degrees, you have at least one or two fingers on the top not too much. In is from the umbilical cord up. Show your hands we use our hands as a nurturer as a touching. So if I can see your hands, it’s more human than if I I only see your shoulders up.

Damona 13:02
Camera positioning is everything on the zoom or FaceTime date for a lot of my clients. There’s an impulse to think of camera angles as we would for Instagram or headshots, but that shouldn’t be the case at all. Treat your COVID style day the same way you would treat a real date to normalize this experience as much as possible. dress in a way that makes you feel confident. Try to be yourself. Remember on an in person dinner date your date would be able to see you from at least the waist up so just keep that in mind but let’s try not to get carried away about the normalization Susan says to remember that people can still see the background behind you make sure you check with a friend that there’s nothing too distracting or nothing that gives away all your secrets. Why you see

Unknown Speaker 13:48
and what the other person see are different. So record yourself and send an if you’re a man send it to a female if you’re a female, send it to a male says is anything on the bathroom. That is giving the wrong message. Because you can present yourself perfectly done. Nails may come care, but I see a mess on the back. And like

Damona 14:11
years ago, I had someone on the show who was a refrigerator analyst. Yeah, so he would have people send in pictures of their dates fridge, and that would tell him everything that he needed to know about the person that they were dating. Like, if they have a lot of fruits and vegetables, then they’re healthy or like he did it from my fridge. He was like, you have like two gold gallons of milk. You must have kids. I’m like, How do you know?

Unknown Speaker 14:39
I have a confession. And let’s see who silently don’t confess the same first date. You’re going to the apartment of the person you’re dating and you go to the bathroom. What is the first thing you do? Open the cabinet? Ah,

Damona 14:54
yes. Or honey look in the toilet. Like if that toilet hasn’t been Oh my God. My husband’s my husband’s bachelor apartment was just I was just talking to him about it actually yesterday as well. Like that was a terrible, terrible apartment. I’m so glad I got him out of there. We all have bachelor apartment horror stories, so maybe it’s good that we can delay the personal hygiene conversation. If your apartment is messy, just tidy up a bit. And don’t use zoom backgrounds. It looks like you’re trying to hide something. But let’s not get too bogged down with your date zoom background, Susan says you need to look at how your date pays attention.

Unknown Speaker 15:36
The first thing that I will look in a person is how we smile to you and how pay attention if you’re shy or an introvert with says put the camera on the system that you only see the person talking to you. Because 75% of the people is afraid to public speaking. This is worse because you seen yourself and you get more nervous from yourself in reflection then from what the other person is doing.

Damona 16:04
I’ve been hearing that from a lot of people that it’s bringing up self esteem issues just having to constantly look at that image of yourself back in the in the window.

Unknown Speaker 16:15
You know what, I have a trick. I something called oxytocin. oxytocin happen when we are taught when we are exchanging with people we like how you replace that in a virtual error. Watching funny videos before you’re going to get to a date to be relax, and to be present and be in a happy place. Three minutes of happy videos or bloopers or pet or whatever, get you to a happy place. Do it and you’re going to see how your body postures is more relaxed. They didn’t imprison. It’s uncomfortable in these computer virtual body language is worse.

Damona 16:58
That’s a really great tip, I reckon. recommend using gifts and funny videos in texting, like that’s a tool when people are like, how do I get the vibe back? I say like send them a joke, send them a gift, send something that you can connect on and laugh about, and that can shortcut getting back into the conversation. What about, like drinking before the date I just, I’m now I was so I write for this column in the Washington Post called date lab where we matchmake for people introduce them and then send them on a date. So for the last few months, the dates of course, have all been on zoom and virtual, which I really hate. Because it’s always the same. It’s always the same date and then people are like, I didn’t really feel a connection. Well, yeah, you just met a stranger that you knew nothing about at least if you’re coming from Bumble or something and then you’re going into the chat you’ve connected you you know that there’s some things in common but this is they’re trusting me and and the date lab team to just set them up and they don’t know who they’re gonna To me, so, anyways, I was just talking to one of the date labs that I’m writing about and they were saying that they, they, they both pre drank to kind of loosen up for the date. I wouldn’t do that but I’m I’m a super lightweight What do you think about about that and like how drinking alcohol can impact the way that you present yourself?

Unknown Speaker 18:20
The pendant how alcohol affecting you, people get aggressive people get too too warm filter it and sometimes the first time is not good.

Damona 18:29
Right? I also I’ve talked about this on the show before but just as a reminder to everyone that’s new to the show or that maybe forgot. Also gamifying the day having an activity exactly what Susan’s saying. Making a theme but also maybe making a game out of it. 20 questions sipping paint night. I just found this app. I swear you guys i’m not i’m not being paid to say this. I just legit really have fun with it. It’s an app called let’s roam and they have in home scavenger On so you can do things where you’re like, you’re like playing this virtual scavenger hunt. And you have to go and grab like your sylius tat or, you know, do it try to do a handstand or something goofy that makes it sort of fun. So those are a few tips for virtual dates. But a lot of people are over the virtual date Susan, they’re ready to move out into the real world. And many people are now even skipping the virtual agent just going right to social distance dates. Well, here’s the problem with social distance day hits. Maybe you’ve seen pictures of someone online but you’re meeting them with a mask on your face reader. You know a lot about human behavior. What can you tell about someone just from looking at the eyes, you know, mid know mid nose and eyes above, they’re wearing a mask.

Unknown Speaker 19:48
First of all, don’t try to show more of your face that you should,

Damona 19:52
you know, like give a little notes.

Unknown Speaker 19:56
Ya know, be the other person is willing to take the mass is willing to take a risk. Then I don’t know if I want to be taken with that person is irresponsible. So actually, everybody seeing that emotions happen on this smile on the lips. Actually the seven microexpression happened on the eyes, the expression of happiness and anger happening on the eyes and the eyebrows on the forehead.

Damona 20:20
So, Tyra Banks was right all along. You smile If you don’t smile.

Unknown Speaker 20:28
Well, some people don’t do it.

Unknown Speaker 20:30
Pay attention to the emotions. Because everybody’s so fixated on the mouth. We’re not paying attention with the eyes is telling us the word and we have all the body to say. I know it’s difficult not to kiss or handshake. Now you can pay attention to other things. And again, go in front of the mirror, put yourself a mask in practice emotions, and I don’t know watch videos, record yourself as your friends to watch a movie together. So You can be analyzed and how emotions happen on the face.

Damona 21:03
This is an important skill to learn because we may be wearing masks for this may be the new normal culturally, this is it’s different in, in the US I know people in other countries like in Asia that this has not, it wasn’t such a leap, right to go into mass culture. But it’s something for a lot of Americans that we have to learn from scratch how to inspect

Unknown Speaker 21:30
the world was born for the first time in Asia, and most Asian people know how to read faces. So whatever you want to learn from this experience is going to make you more human in a better communicator.

Damona 21:46
This is an unprecedented period of time, and we’re forced to reconnect in a completely different way. But hopefully, this episode convinced you that this doesn’t mean that the quality of our connections has to be any different If you learned anything new from Susan, you should check out our previous episode together. Or you can see the amazing private session she did with one of our listeners Mel. Susan actually was able to read some really personal qualities about her just by looking at her face and use that information to set her up for success in dating. They are exclusively available on Patreon and I’m not bragging or nothing but they really did work. You will see us dissect Mel’s profile and really set her up for success. Just a month after our session she met her ideal match and they’re still dating today I just checked in with her so go learn what you need to do to your profile just by watching Susan punch up Mel’s profile with me. from each of our individual expertise. The cost is just five bucks to join and you can get those profile hacking videos plus bonus dates and mates content including a live q&a at Behind the mike session every single week on Facebook, if you love this show, if you’ve gotten helpful advice from me, why not support us to keep making this content and join the club for just $5 patreon.com slash dates and mates? In a moment, I’ll be answering your dating questions and dear Dimona, so don’t go anywhere. We’re back. This is dear to Mona.

Mona help me. I so love that new intro. I hope you do too. Thanks to my dear friend Jenny Wren genuine music for recording that. All right, we have so many questions I’m going to answer to today but just know if your question doesn’t get answered. It is in queue to be answered on a future episode. This one came to us from M she says she’s been listening to the podcast for about a year. Thank you. Um, she says she’s having some trouble reading herself. These days, she’s 26 and online dating, and she’s feeling like she’s ready to meet someone to start her life with. This is what um, says the past few people I’ve been talking with, and dating are really sweet and easy to talk to. But I’m not feeling attracted to them once I meet them, even after a few or several dates, I’m trying to figure out if it’s just that I’m not ready to be dating right now. Or if the person or these people are not the right match for me, or do I just need to keep putting myself out there for new matches? Well, I think this is a problem that a lot of the people at home are nodding their heads to like, yeah, girl been there. And you cannot force a connection. But what you can do is evaluate your dating patterns. And if this is a longtime pattern of you, like you go out with someone a few times, and it fizzles or you don’t start to feel butterflies, and this has happened over and over and over again, not just the last few months, but like the last few years, then that might be something thing that you want to evaluate because it might be that who you think you’re attracted to, and who you’re responding to, on paper is different than who you would respond to say, in person or who you feel natural chemistry towards. Of course, everything’s different in COVID. And we’re only really able to meet people virtually at first right now. So I really would love for you to spend some time getting in touch with your own attractions like as you’re watching a movie like Who who are you feeling attracted to you when you’re watching a movie as you are? I don’t know on a group video chat with friends. like God forbid you’re not going to Las Vegas Pool Party. Please tell me you’re not doing that. But if you do, you know who what, what is it that you are attracted to an individual people What are you curious about? And some of it is the pool I’m sure if you are not putting yourself out On enough dates, I think sometimes we put too much pressure on each individual date, if you’re only going on, say, one date, a month. But if you feel like you have a lot of people in the pipeline, and when I say going out on one date a month I, it could be a video chat date, it could be a social distance date. But if you aren’t getting enough options in the pipeline, it can feel like you’re putting so much pressure on somebody to work even if it’s not really a match. So I would take a step back, go to that mindset piece that I’m always talking about, and then go to that, that place of attraction and see what is the pattern? What am I responding to, and what am I getting? Where am I feeling this lack of attraction and see if you can, you can analyze yourself a little bit and then create a dating plan that’s going to be more successful for you off of that. Another question comes to us from Jocelyn she says she loves the podcast and she You heard our advice on dating during the pandemic. You may remember that episode a couple weeks ago with dear frannie. And I got a couple of notes about my comments on testing. Of course I am in California, I’m in Los Angeles, where we can, we can test as often as we like, and it’s totally covered and free. I realized that is not the case for everyone everywhere. Some of you picked up on the fact that I clarified that, but you have to, first of all get up to speed on what is available in your area and some places you may not have been able to test before but there may be testing available now. So you have to constantly stay on top of I call it the coronas the corona news, but this person says that my advice didn’t quite fit her situation. Here’s the deal with Jocelyn. She says she’s a single 41 year old nurse working in a hospital with potential exposure to coronavirus on a daily basis. He says I have to work hard to keep myself safe and healthy. But obviously some risk still exists.

It’s a it’s difficult for many healthcare providers to get tested. She says she’s never been tested, and doing so on a regular and ongoing basis is unrealistic for her. I totally get that. She’s seeing very few people and would be okay accepting a man into her bubble. But she says she’s only interested in someone as careful as she is. Is it hypocritical of me as a nurse to ask for this level of caution? Jocelyn, it’s not hypocritical for you as a nurse. It’s, it’s not hypocritical for anyone listening right now to try to understand somebody’s risk tolerance, and ask for a basic level of respect. It’s sort of like asking for exclusivity, right. Like you have that conversation. And as long as they’re on the same page, and they give you their word that they’re going to be faithful to you then. It is a covenant. It is immigrant. remount of the relationship, and especially in a situation that you’re in, thank you, first of all, for serving the people of your state and your city. And being there to help people who are dealing with COVID. I can only imagine the the mental toll that takes on you and how that impacts when you’re dating, the way that you filter through your dates. So you are Yes, in a situation that is different, where you need to be very careful of who you invite into your bubble. But for anyone listening, I think we should use as much caution as possible. I just heard a story of a person that got COVID because he went on a double date with with somebody that he didn’t know and then turns out that person had COVID and all four of them on the double date COVID this is just back in June. Like let’s let’s be cautious. Let’s use common sense the one of the most intimate things you can do is to go on a date with somebody or just to, to, like, I went somewhere with a friend. And we’d both recently been tested and I had to ride in the car with her and I was like, okay, we’re taking our masks off. I swear it felt like having sex without a condom for the first time. It’s a little bit scary to break down that barrier and release that wall. And especially in a situation like your job has to come first right now we really need you, Jocelyn. We need you to stay healthy. So anyone that you date has to be held to that same standard and anybody who really would be an appropriate long term partner for you would understand that. Hope that helps you and hope that helps everyone that’s listening on navigating the new normal and dating and relationships. This was Episode 324 of dates inmates if you’re looking out for some more personalized human behavior hacking. Check out Susan at human behavior. labs.com she can do one of these analyses, like, like she did for Mel for you too. And if you want to see what we did for Mel, check out the Patreon to support the show and get all of that behind the scenes and bonus content. It’s just $5 at patreon.com, slash dates, and mates. Also, we will give you a shortcut to today’s headline articles. And, of course, our gift game is strong thanks to producer Leo. Check all that out at dates and mates calm and there’s other free goodies there waiting for you and other show recaps. Remember the Registration is open now for my free webinar on September 2, you can sign up for free at the dating secret.com and I’ll share the secret with you hit me up on all the socials I’m at damona Hoffman you can DM me, let me know what you learned from today’s episode. Or send me a question that I can answer for an upcoming episode of dates and mates. I’ll be back again next. Next week with a deep dive on dating app algorithms. Until then, I wish you happy dating

Dating CEO & Romance Scams

DATING LIKE A CEO

If you’re reading this right now, we know you are a Boss – the CEO of your life, if you will. But sometimes those CEO qualities just don’t match up with your dating life.

Today we’re learning from dating coach and image consultant, Neely Steinberg who will show us how to boss up in our love lives the way we do in business. BE THE CEO OF YOUR LOVE LIFE!! Remember that Love Lessons episode on first impressions? Well, she also has some fab style tips on how to present yourself the way you want to be seen. 

Bye Little Black Dress. Buh- bye.

But first, Damona covers headlines:

DATING DISH (1:28)

Demi Lovato’s relationship is running on quarantine standard time

Did you see who Demi Lovato is dating? Excuse us… Engaged to (according to our sources) ?

FBI WARNING:

Dating Scams are on the rise! HighSpeedInternet.com gives us all the stats.

The Kinsey Institute tells men to just… please… keep it in your pants.

New study on dick pics from the Kinsey Institute! Damona breaks it down.

BE THE CEO OF YOUR DATING LIFE (11:00)

Damona is joined by Neely Steinberg, a dating coach and personal image consultant who helps smart, savvy women take back their power and become the CEO of their dating and love lives. Neely has a Masters degree in Counseling and has been running her business for a decade.

We leave it all on the table

  • Is Match the best dating app out there?
  • How to “massage” the dating app algorithm
  • How to boss up and CEO your dating life
  • How to dress for your body shape

Make sure to check Damona out on Going to Bed with Garcelle later this season!

TECHNICALLY DATING (29:40)

Submit your questions Instagram, Twitter, or Facebook and hear our answers live on the show! Here’s what our listeners asked about this week:

  • I met a guy on match and we’ve done an audio call in a video call and where having a masked walk and talk tomorro w. I’m trying to be open minded but he is 10 years older 64!
  • I wrote my crush a love letter a week ago and haven’t received a real response. (Y’all she sent me the love letter and it was beautifully written) He hasn’t responded to the letter, but he let me know that he’s read it and has been keeping distance so he can process. What should I do?

 

 

Best of all, it’s super affordable – Dates & Mates listeners like you get 10% off your first month with discount code DATESANDMATES 

So why not get started today? We all need someone to talk to right now. Go to BetterHelp.com/datesandmates so you can fill out a questionnaire to help them assess your needs and get matched with a counselor you’ll love.

 

 

What is Patreon?

Patreon is a platform that allows you to support creators like me to keep making helpful content that you want to hear and allow you to get amazing listener benefits by participating

Our page is Patreon.com/datesandmates

What will you get if you sign up?

There are three different tiers. One for our loyal listeners who want to connect with others and keep this show going strong for another 7 seasons.

Sign up at patreon.com/datesandmates for: 

  • an opportunity to work with Damona directly
  • to get quality advice that is tailored to your dating challenges
  • and to become part of a community that will help you find the healthiest, most loving relationships this year

WANT TO GO EVEN DEEPER? HERE IS A TRANSCRIPT OF THE SHOW IF YOU WANT TO FOLLOW ALONG!

Date of the Union & The Entanglement

HOW TO DATE TODAY: ENTANGLEMENT NOW

This week we’re answering the question: Can you date today? Or can all we hope for is just a summer “entanglement?”

Damona gives a “Date of the Union Address” devoted to helping you understand the current dating and entanglement landscape plus get you up to speed on the top headlines that we missed during the Love Lessons special series.

First up, we do the dish with Damona’s co-host for the day, Steve Barnes:

DATING DISH (1:28)

Will and Jada and The Big “Entanglement”

We know you’ve heard about Will and Jada… plus August. But we still have questions: Was this “entanglement” staged? Do Will and Jada have an open relationship? Damona and Steve have some experience with Will and Jada that might change your mind of some of these questions…

via GIPHY

Royally Screwed

So Princess Beatrice’s wedding didn’t go as planned. Not only did COVID completely cut the guest list down to 100 and push it back… her dad’s entanglement in the Epstein case also cast a shadow on a day. Damona and Steve discuss.

via GIPHY

Once and For All: What makes a great relationship

Samantha Joel et al of Western University in London, Ontario have completed the most comprehensive and successful study to answer the question, “what makes a great relationship?” According to Joel, the partnership you build is more important than the partner you pick. Read CNN’s full article here!

via GIPHY

DATE OF THE UNION: THE STATE OF DATE TODAY (11:00)

We are joined by fan-favorite dating coach Francesca Hogi! You’ve heard her wonderful advice on the podcast before, but if you’re new here, Franny is a love and life coach for extraordinary people who happen to be single.

Fun Fact: She is the co-host of the podcast Romantical and the host of the podcast Dear Franny: Uncommon Conversations About Love.

She’s here to help Damona to this “Date of The Union Address” right!

We cover:

  • Were dating coaches wrong? Maybe this isn’t the best time to find love?
  • The New Courtship Timeline: dating is slower, but relationships are moving at lightning speed
  • Summer Time Love is Fake
  • The exact steps to take to find love right now
  • Why you should be on two dating platforms – and we tell you which ones those are
  • Why you should be stalking the people you’re interested in

Read Franny’s full list here!

TECHNICALLY DATING (29:40)

Submit your questions Instagram, Twitter, or Facebook and hear our answers live on the show! Here’s what our listeners asked about this week:

  • Danette –Is 2 weeks to soon to start saying “I love you”? I’ve met someone who is working abroad and we have established quite a nice text relationship. He is head over heels for me and keeps telling me he loves me. We haven’t met yet. I have strong feelings for him but this is making me uncomfortable. How do I elegantly ask him to slow down.
  •  Mary – I wanted to know if in your segment on Dating While Social Distancing, do you have recommendations on physical intimacy? What if you find someone that you would like to start a committed physical relationship with? How do you navigate and set safety agreements?

What is Patreon?

Patreon is a platform that allows you to support creators like me to keep making helpful content that you want to hear and allow you to get amazing listener benefits by participating

Our page is Patreon.com/datesandmates

What will you get if you sign up?

There are three different tiers. One for our loyal listeners who want to connect with others and keep this show going strong for another 7 seasons.

Sign up at patreon.com/datesandmates for: 

  • an opportunity to work with Damona directly
  • to get quality advice that is tailored to your dating challenges
  • and to become part of a community that will help you find the healthiest, most loving relationships this year

 

WANT TO GO EVEN DEEPER? HERE IS A TRANSCRIPT OF THE SHOW IF YOU WANT TO FOLLOW ALONG!

Unknown Speaker 0:00
It’s a tale as old as time. He’s handsome, debonair. She’s pretty and sweet. They lock eyes across the room.

Damona 0:10
Okay, hold on, honey, you need to get your facts straight. Finding love today is more like we supposed to get my swipe. I just want

Unknown Speaker 0:19
somebody to share my life. What

Unknown Speaker 0:20
does this text mean? Maybe he’s just not that into me or even I met him on the street. I know which hospital he worked at. I knew his name is I slid into his DMS

Damona 0:30
on Twitter. You can keep waiting for the fairy tale, or you can get on forward with the new rules of relationships. If you’ve read my advice in the LA Times, then you know, this ain’t your mama’s love advice. This is dates in mates with damona Hoffman,

Unknown Speaker 0:47
members of Congress,

Unknown Speaker 0:49
the President of the United States.

Damona 0:53
Thank you, Madam Speaker. Members of Congress, Madam Vice President lovers, This day marks eight years essentially two terms as you’re leading dating and relationship official. We kicked off the season strong with an interview and coaching demo with the real housewives garcelle Beauvais last week. It was beautiful. It was the very best American dating podcast episode about the best. And now it’s time to address your concerns in a date of the Union Address. All right, in all seriousness, we’re in a challenging time for dating and relationships and everyone needs love now more than ever. So today’s episode is devoted to helping you understand the current dating landscape and getting you up to speed on the top headlines that we missed during the love lessons special series. To do all of this. I have two exciting guests joining me today for updates on the date of the Union. Do you get it data you didn’t get it? Well, I have a fan favorite love coach joining me Francesca hoagie who will give us the exact steps that motivated singles need to take right now if they’re looking to find love. But first, we have the headlines. Of course we missed some huge headlines including will and jaida and the big entanglement and the royal wedding. No the other royal wedding, didn’t you here, plus the latest and most accurate study on what makes a great relationship. Then at the end of the show, Francesca and I will handle your questions including Is it true love or is it a catfish? And when is it safe to get physical with your quarantine crush? Joining me to tackle the headlines of the day is my dear friend Barnes. He’s an actor and producer plus. You may also know him from over 20 years of experience as a radio personality specifically as the host of Atlanta’s number one morning radio show. The morning acts for many years. Now, he’s the host of a hot new podcast called the Pop Culture Show. Along with cmts, Leslie Fram and Kobe Bryant from nycs 106. point seven. Please help me give big smooches to my co host for today, Barnes thank you

Unknown Speaker 3:19
very much good to see you. damona.

Damona 3:21
My friend, I was thinking about who can help me figure out what we missed in the time that we were doing our love lessons and who is always on top of the headlines. And of course, it’s you. Of course we do this every week already on the Pop Culture Show. So why not do it here on dates and mates?

Unknown Speaker 3:40
I’ve listened to your podcast for years you’ve been doing it for so long gratulations on all the success.

Damona 3:45
Thank you. And obviously you are a legend in radio and podcasting. So I’m just honored. You’re here to break down these headlines with us. Are you ready to dish with me Barnes

Unknown Speaker 3:56
I am always ready. Let’s do it.

Damona 4:00
stating dish. Bowsher and everyone in the internet has been talking about will and jayda. This all went down when we were doing our love lessons, but it’s just too important not to talk about, in case you haven’t heard and you’ve been living under a rock jayda had what she calls in entanglement with August alsina. And it turns out it happened during a break when she and we’ll were on a break. So she brought herself and will to the red table to talk this all through. Barnes. I got to know from you. I mean, you’ve been covering pop culture for a long time and there’s been a lot of rumors about willing Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 4:40
for a while. We talked about this in the pop culture show while you’re on vacation. And it what’s weird to me is if you follow all of the clues and all the bread crumbs that have been dropped, first of all on the red table show on Facebook, he called it I believe in a fair or a situation And she quickly corrected him and said entanglement and I think that’s key because August seen us song entanglement was already created made and on the platter ready to come out. It’s very suspicious to me I think something weird is going on with that whole thing even though they have a piece of it and this is just a big Hollywood play. I don’t know what’s happening but all the things said in the song are even Rick Ross is wrapped talking about Will Smith kind of under the lines. It’s strange. Just

Damona 5:32
looking at the read Table Talk episode. I just really felt that will was coming from a very honest place. I feel like the bond between them is so strong that, you know we like to banter about what’s going on. I feel like it is and they’ve been I mean, they’ve been together for what like two

Unknown Speaker 5:53
decades. Come on. You know Hollywood. Something is weird about this whole situation. That August is Seen a coming out with an entanglement song and the way she was so purpose driven in mentioning it during that whole thing with Will I agree with you will seem like he was coming from a very honest place. She, however, was the complete antithesis of that. I felt like she was very fake, and very contrived. And very, she was very flippant with him.

Damona 6:24
I’m just surprised that she was able to keep this a secret while doing red Table Talk for so long. But

Unknown Speaker 6:30
all that aside motion,

Damona 6:32
all promotion, let’s say you’re here, so Hollywood with the pop culture analysis. But let’s say for our listeners who are watching this thinking, Oh, that could be me. I just want to know what your thoughts are on the open relationship situation. Like let’s say it wasn’t even really against the rules of relation, the relationship and they are just in an open relationship. Do you think that we’re going to be seeing more more people coming out and saying The rules of your relationship do not apply to me.

Unknown Speaker 7:03
What legendary for years, they’ve had an open relationship and they’ve had multiple people in and out of it. That’s what people say. They came into our studios one time, she came in one time and was very like, she’s the princess snapping those fingers through the hallways like with her whole, you know, posse following her. And he’s the same way we interviewed Well, a long time ago, and he had like multiple people around him. They’re just very contrived. I feel like they’ve gone on a path to their stardom. And even this open relationship thing could just be something to get people talking. But the August I’ll who is August alsina. I mean, Where did he come from? See all of a sudden he’s being talked about.

Damona 7:44
So what is it? Clearly they understand it, they’re pulling all the strings and yes, we are just talking about it. And yes, we’re going to probably buy that.

Unknown Speaker 7:53
But that read the table. Once again, 15 million or something or more views

Damona 7:59
barn’s Let me tell you though. That show is so good. I mean, we could talk about that all day. But you mentioned that she came in like the princess. There was news about an actual princess that happened while we were in the love lesson sessions as well. Princess Beatrice finally got married on July 17.

Unknown Speaker 8:17
This is great

Damona 8:18
delicious snack, Edoardo mapelli mazzi. And she had to keep changing her plans like it seemed like everybody else was just conspiring against her wedding. You may remember back in the fall there when all the Epstein drama was happening. Prince Andrew just fully put his foot in his mouth and they were like, okay, can’t get married now because obviously people are going to be talking about that. And then COVID happens. And so you know, here all of her cousins get these lavish weddings and carriage processions and they’re like, we’re just going to do a tiny little family only thing and and keep it really small but I can’t believe that that Really what she wanted I think she kind of just got the short end of the stick

Unknown Speaker 9:04
well with Prince Andrew and everything going on with Jeffrey Epstein. That’s number one and they use COVID kind of as an excuse. I mean, the Queen didn’t even stay the whole time. The Queen was like, in and out out he but by the Epstein thing, there are still things coming out with that.

Damona 9:20
Oh, it’s so sketchy sketch and like for everyone listening I’m sure a lot of us had plans that got disrupted from COVID. And a lot of us had weddings or in I just heard from a client who was engaged who had to break off her engagement cuz her her her fiance is stuck in another country. It’s it’s been wild, but maybe like you said, Maybe this is a blessing in disguise for them. And then they can just focus on the relationship being about the two of them and not deal with all their drama. And look at this. This is the royal family. And they have all that same drama. Like don’t invite him to the wedding. Who knows wasn’t Sheila

Unknown Speaker 9:59
she was With an American for what, almost 10 years

Unknown Speaker 10:05
research now

Unknown Speaker 10:07
it’s the pop culture show up on Pop Culture Show, I’m just doing dates and maids.

Unknown Speaker 10:12
She was with this guy. Beatrice was with this American for, I want to say 10 years. And when they broke it off, whoever broke it off, he was engaged in a hot minute. So that’s very interesting. And American, I believe living in London, and they get broken up. However, they got broken up, and then all of a sudden, magically, he’s engaged

Damona 10:34
in it. You know, when it works, it works when it doesn’t work. It doesn’t work. But that reminds me of a new cnn study that was just published on what makes a successful relationship. And they looked at successful couples. Everyone’s always asking me like, what are the qualities that I need to present to be ready for a relationship or what should I be looking for? What are the red flags? Turns out Barnes it’s ain’t even about you. It’s more about the relationship. And it turns out that the satisfaction the relationship matters a lot more than the individual characteristics. So thinking of things like, like perceived partner commitment, like if you feel like your partner is committed to you, that’s, that can really indicate that you’re going to be in it for the long haul, or appreciation, of course, sexual satisfaction, perceived partner satisfaction, and conflict. I found this study fascinating Barnes and

Unknown Speaker 11:32
I know every, like every hot button. Well, I mean, isn’t that the bottom lines, but I do? Well, hitting the hot button. I guess that’s the key to a successful relationship right now is the third point. But beyond that, it’s Can you ever get it perfect? Because if you had those four things, or whatever that are this, you know, that are the base of a relationship, and three of them are working here. All right.

Damona 11:57
Yeah. Like everyone’s looking for the Holy Grail. I don’t know about I’ve been watching that show Indian matchmaking on Netflix. And you know, so they have the, well, we’re not gonna get into the controversy, but they look at the bio data, right of all the people that they’re matching. And they go so far as to send them to astrologers and to do face readings to try to get the compatibility, right. But really, it’s just about their, their commitment. When you look at it that way. It reminds me actually, you know, my husband, and I remember in the beginning, I was like, What do you like about me? And he was like, I like how you make me feel. And I was like, that’s a cop out. Give me some compliments. But now that I’m seeing this study, it makes a lot of sense that it was more about the relationship and how he felt in the relationship than necessarily that that I was doing anything special.

Unknown Speaker 12:52
Well, look at all the look at all the reality shows. I watch all of them all the dating shows, it’s weird. Nothing is good enough for Anybody,

Damona 13:00
well, you can’t reality TV, you can help who you love. But I’ll put up the the link to the study, of course in the show notes, dates and mates calm. But there were something some individual characteristics that could predict whether you will be satisfied in a relationship or not. These are really interesting barns, life satisfaction, negative effect, depression, attachment avoidance and attachment, anxiety. If you haven’t read the book attached, you can learn about your attachment style, but I was like, This is the key. We did all of these exercises in love languages to get clear on our partner but also to get really comfortable with ourselves. And that seems to be a big factor much more than looking for those qualities in your partner.

Unknown Speaker 13:50
Have you seen the show? I’m sorry, on Netflix.

Damona 13:52
Yeah, no, I heard it’s really funny.

Unknown Speaker 13:54
All about dating. They’re trying to will feroza an executive producer and they’re trying To be the almost Sex in the City, but kind of quirky of this age. I’ll be curious to see what you think about but they talk about these things.

Damona 14:08
I know like three years. I’ll have some on demand. Oh, I know. I have a lot to watch and very little time. I’m busy watching love love on the spectrum. That’s a good one. Barnes. Where’s that? I haven’t heard that. So Netflix, but it’s people who are on the autism spectrum looking

Unknown Speaker 14:23
Oh, I have not seen that. I did see that. I saw it but I didn’t see it. so

Damona 14:27
fabulous. cringe worthy at moments. But actually, you could. everyone listening could learn a lot about relationships by watching what these people go through, because they have to teach them just basic social skills and interaction like things that I assume for a lot of the people listening should just come naturally. But it’s reinforces what I say that dating is really a learned skill. And so sometimes we need to just break down all of the steps and make sure that you’re building the relationship in the right way from the beginning.

Unknown Speaker 15:00
Netflix is full of shows like that. I’ll give you two more for homework. Okay, on twisted relationships. One is called Dr. Foster. Okay, which is a UK show a must see on Netflix, I’m

Damona 15:10
sure they have a bad name, Beatrice,

Unknown Speaker 15:13
Beatrice, and then the other ones, another UK show called liar. And those are both about twisted relationships. But a lot of the things you talk about are exhibited in these people. And to your point, is it you the couple, or is it you the individual that’s making the relationship go sideways? If you focus on yourself and make yourself better, is that going to make collectively a better relationship? Now you’ve got to worry about the other side.

Damona 15:39
So much to do. You’re giving me homework barns. That’s

Unknown Speaker 15:43
what we do.

Damona 15:44
This is why I listened to the pop culture show, which all of you can hear at the pop culture show.com or wherever you get your podcast, because Barnes keeps us up to speed on what we need to know whether we’re talking dating and relationships or what’s happening on the hutzler or anything else? You’re my source Barnes and I appreciate you being here.

Unknown Speaker 16:05
We have to have you on our show soon. It’s Mondays at 10am we dropped a new episode.

Damona 16:08
I love it. I can’t wait to be on that show and I can’t wait to have you back to do the headlines with me again here on dates inmates. Thank you. That’s for dish. We’ll be back with updates and actionable advice in my date of the union address with Francesca hoagie. But first, I have to ask, can we be friends? Can we be friends with benefits? It’s not what you think. In case you haven’t heard already, I have a Patreon group for my true friends who want a little more support and love. If you’re looking for a community of daters and behind the scenes insights from me, then you are the perfect person to become one of my friends with benefits on Patreon. You can check it out@patreon.com slash dates and mates. And when you become a member of our community, you get a private Facebook group where you can chat with me and other listeners of the show. You’ll also get access to the behind the mic live stream talk back each week all about that week’s episode, plus secret behind the scenes content from over 300 episodes of dates and mates and 10% off of any of my online programs too. There’s even more, you can read all about it@patreon.com slash dates and dates, and you can join for just $5. And that will allow me to hopefully keep the show going for another eight more seasons as well. Okay, don’t go anywhere. The date of the union is coming right up.

Welcome back. I am here with one of the Dayton mates fan favorites dating coach Francesca hoagie. You’ve heard her wonderful advice and stories on this podcast before but if you’re new here frannie is a love and life coach for extraordinary people who happen To be single, fun fact she was also a contestant on two seasons of the CBS reality show survivor. Francesca is the co host of the podcast romantical and the host of the awesome podcast, dear frannie uncommon conversations about love. And she’s here to have some uncommon conversations with me and do this date of the Union address, right? So please give big smooches to my friend Francesca hoagie. Hey, hi. Thank you hear me, Danny, welcome back. Thank you. Thanks. I’ve been going down

Unknown Speaker 18:38
since the last time you’re on the show. You know, the world just it’s it’s, it’s changed like 20 times in the last six months. It’s pretty extraordinary.

Damona 18:49
That is exactly why I wanted to do this show because we talked about dating like, I’ll be honest, I started out super optimistic me two months ago. Yeah. And I was like, this is great, you guys. Yeah, sure. All my listeners

Unknown Speaker 19:00
are laughing or laughing right now we were all so excited. We’re like, this is actually gonna be the best thing ever everyone.

Damona 19:06
And I think there are positives to it. Like I was saying it slowing down the dating process, which was on hyperspeed and really needed something to recalibrate it. I wasn’t really counting on this, but here we are.

Unknown Speaker 19:21
Here we are. But yeah, yeah.

Damona 19:23
Now like we’re, what, five months into quarantine? Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 19:27
10 years, one or the

Damona 19:29
other. It feels like 10 years. And I feel like from my clients and the listeners who’ve written into the show, I feel like the the tone has changed a little bit. And the fatigue is setting in and the frustration is coming up again. So what are you seeing in your practice?

Unknown Speaker 19:47
Yeah, I’m seeing the same thing. I was really really optimistic at the beginning of quarantine and I saw my clients I think, when it first when everything first started walking down there Really was this wave of people who were like, Okay, well, this is it is what it is, it’s not going to be for that long. So like, let’s just, you know, have some video dates and get to know people. And that was happening, like very much happening for my clients like pretty easily at the beginning and I was like, Oh my god, this is amazing. Everybody’s gonna meet their husband and quarantine are gonna be all these like, you know, Corona love stories. And there will be there will be but I’ve just seen it kind of like that initial wave just kind of crash a bit. And it seems like, like you said that fatigue is set in. Which by the way, I mean, even if it wasn’t a pandemic, like this is not, you know, summertime is not the best time to be looking for a serious relationship in general. Because people are always more distracted in the summer and just have, you know, shorter attention spans. And so I thought that kind of the fact that we are still all quarantining for the most part, hopefully would extend This kind of honeymoon period, but it’ll come back around because you know, fall was coming. cuffing season is coming.

Damona 21:06
cuffing season is right around the corner. I’m a big fan of the zoom dates, but I have always said, and for my patreon friends with benefits, there’s a there’s a special video I did that’s just on how to ace a video chat date, because it’s a separate process. And I think a lot of people were kind of slipping into just like, oh, you’re here, let me just click into, you know, the Bumble video or asked or meet me on zoom. And it was like you said it was not very mindful and very fatiguing. And we have to still have something to build up to we have. We’ve lost that anticipation, right? Because there used to be that I’m going to meet this person for the first time. What am I going to wear? How is my hair going to be done?

Unknown Speaker 21:51
Why are they did all that like yeah, excitement. Yeah, it’s so

Damona 21:54
intimate, bringing someone into your home like you’ve never met them and now they’re visiting But still, yeah, that’s a whole different level. It’s a whole different level. Totally. We even get there. You wrote this fantastic blog. You guys when I mean not gender, y’all, this blog is so, so on the money about all the things that you should be doing right now, if you’re looking for love. So she says she’s in a relationship now. But she says, I’m a love coach, if I was single, here’s how I would find love during COVID. So can we just run through it? I want people to check out this blog too. But I can let’s give some of the highlights. You in the blog, you differentiate between dating, traditional dating sites and dating apps. I’ve talked about this on the past in the past on the show, but for the noobs. Let’s get everybody up to speed on the difference between those two things.

Unknown Speaker 22:51
Yes, absolutely. And thank you for the kind words by the way, from the heart girl. So a traditional dating site, you know, Think the will the classic one match.com. Right like so you think of you go on a site, you can put in your search parameters, you run searches, the site suggests people to you, you can message anybody you want, whether they live, you know, down the street from you or across the world. So it’s really you have more controls over your kind of what you’re doing on the site, just because of the way that it’s set up. And also, the profiles on a traditional dating site are they’re just more detailed. So, you know, if you’re looking at a dating app, you might have 400 500 characters say everything you need to say about yourself, which is not a lot of not a lot of room, you know, basically like two tweets. So the subtle lot of room but if you go on to a traditional site, then you can say as much as you want. I mean, you don’t want to say too much, right? You don’t want to bore people with your life story, but you know you you have more of a chance to express yourself a little bit more Your personality, who you’re looking for the kind of relationship you want to have. And you know, all apps have a free version, most of them also have a paid version where you can, you know, upgrade to get some extra bells and whistles. But for the most part, the app experience is a free one. And the traditional sites also usually have a free version, but you do want to pay because the paid versions are where you can really get the full benefit of a traditional site. So the cost, the just the functionality, you know, like I said, on a traditional site, you can sort of run searches and be a little bit more targeted about who you’re looking at. Whereas on a dating app, the algorithm is just basically showing you everyone in your area, who generally is the gender and age that you’re looking for. I mean, you can kind of pay to get a little bit more specific on certain apps, but you’re definitely casting a wider net on apps.

Damona 24:55
Yes, that’s so true. And you also talk about the algorithm and Yes, thank you. I say this to my clients to like, you can be on Coffee Meets Bagel, which is a great app, y’all. But you get one match a day there. And there’s not really much I can do in the algorithm for you. But on like an OkCupid, or a match, I have different ways that I can search I can do I have different ways that I can signal to the app, what you’re looking for. Yes, right. Yeah. So do you feel like it’s a it’s a either or situation or you feel like everybody should be on both a traditional and an app? And is there a max number of apps that you’ve seen people be able to juggle?

Unknown Speaker 25:40
Yeah. So I think ideally, you’d be on to, okay. And I when I say ideally, I mean, this is this is current, okay, so this is August 2020, you know, COVID-19 times, three months ago, four months ago, five months ago, I wasn’t recommending that, that people be on both our traditional site and an app. The reason And I’m doing that now is because because on a traditional site, the bar to entry is a little bit higher, you know, you’ve got to pay, you’ve got to put more work into your profile. My suspicion is that this is the time that you want to, you want to go there, that’s where you want to be like, if you’re looking for something serious, that’s where you want to be. If you’re willing to put in the time and the effort to really get to know someone without the instant gratification of like getting to hang out with them. I think that you are more likely to find more people who are willing to invest that same amount of time on a traditional site, which is why I’m recommending that right now. Particularly for the person who has been on a dating app and you’re feeling really like frustrated, burnt out, you know, you feel like you’re out of matches, like you’ve seen everybody you know, in your city or town, then that’s a good opportunity. Also, I spoken to people who are now because of everything that’s going on and maybe their jobs situation, they’re more geographically flexible, because they’re like, well, I live live in New York, but I, my job now is going to be I can work wherever. So maybe I live somewhere where I can have a better quality of life. So they’re even more open to moving. And if you’re more open to moving, you can go on and OkCupid or match. And you can say, all right, these are the five cities I’m interested in, and you can start running searches for people in those cities, and start connecting with them. So yeah,

Damona 27:22
that I have to admit I’m, I’m definitely adapting my traditional strategy a little bit. And, and it’s also specific to each client. Like I have a client who’s looking for something very specific. And she’s kind of gotten to the end of the Bumble role. And yeah, so I was like, normally, I would not say you need to be on four apps at a time. But if you’re looking for something really specific and you’re eager to get things rolling, like if you don’t have time to play the long game for whatever reason, you know, you’re goals or biological clock or whatever, then maybe this is a good time because you’re working from home and you have more free time. Maybe this is a good time to juggle more apps, as long as you can be active on it. Right? Like, you don’t want to be missing messages and, and being flaky.

Unknown Speaker 28:17
Yeah, exactly. And it basically comes down to Yeah, what is your bandwidth? You know, I mean, I have some clients for, you know, to be on one platform is enough, like, that takes enough of their time, their energy they get, they get enough matches, you know, so they have plenty, they already like, you know, I have plenty of people to, to communicate with who they feel are more or less fitting their criteria. So if you’re in that position, then great, like, do what you’re doing. But if you’re not in that position, and you do have the bandwidth to expand and, and again, I was writing this blog post from my perspective, like this is literally me Francesca hoagie. If my boyfriend and I broke up tomorrow. What would I Well, if we broke up tomorrow, I wouldn’t actually go right now I have to rethink my whole life. But

Damona 29:08
we’re talking how you and your boyfriend, Matt, because you also talk about this. Yeah. And the blog and I think this is really important for a lot of folks listening but especially women, women, folks, yes. Yes, you met IRL. But then you hadn’t you hunted him down girl. I did I do that and YG.

Unknown Speaker 29:32
I met him very briefly on the street on the corner of sunset and tahini and Beverly Hills. And

Damona 29:41
that’s a good corner. It was by the way, it was.

Unknown Speaker 29:45
It was like a brief exchange. He was with his brother and we had all just been at the screening and his brother recognized me. So his brother like was like, Oh, hey, how’d you like the movie? So I started talking to them briefly. And I just thought he was really interesting. I just thought he was like, I know that. We’re just Something about him and our brief interaction. And we had this moment where we kind of made eye contact and like, there was just kind of like, oh, there’s just something there, you know. And I just really listened to my intuition. And my intuition just was really like screaming. You’re like, you’re supposed to keep talking to him. And I didn’t know why. But then we went our separate ways, because he was getting in an Uber to go home

Damona 30:24
and be weird to chase the nuber. Right? Yeah. But we have social media,

Unknown Speaker 30:34
social media, and I knew it too. I was like, I have enough information about him to find him because I knew that he was a scientist. I knew that he worked. I knew which hospital he worked at in LA. I knew he was Australian. I knew his name. So I was like, this is this. I can do that. I got this.

Damona 30:53
And then dm him.

Unknown Speaker 30:55
Yeah. So I slid into his DMS on Twitter and I just said they were was really nice meeting you. And that was my like, that was like my digital link. You know, it was like if he’s interested, because I didn’t know if he could have been married, he could have been, you know, from what I could see from his Twitter. I couldn’t tell, but it was all science. So I was like, there’s nothing personal there. And so, you know, he could have been gay, like, a million things. So I had no idea but I was like, if he’s available and interested, this is enough for him to like latch on to. And it was. So that’s how we met.

Damona 31:29
Oh, my gosh, I am so impressed with because I think a lot of women would, I’m always saying on the show, to take initiative and just just open the door. It’s not changing the rules of chivalry, just to be to show that you’re open, right. But I think a lot of people are afraid that if they start the relationship off that way, that then the whole gender dynamics of the relationship. We’ll be off forever. Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 32:02
yeah. Well, part of it is like there’s, there’s this definitely takes a little finesse like this is dating. I love dating. And I think that dating is so important because you learn so much you learn so much about yourself. You learn so much about other people you learn so much like, just about what’s really important in connection if you if you do it the right way, if you do it intentionally and you actually pay attention to what you’re doing. And there’s a difference between being proactive and doing something like I did, which was like, number one cyber stalking him. And number two sliding into his DMS right like me doing that. Some people be like, Oh my god, I don’t want to chase the guy. I don’t want to chase the guy either. And I didn’t chase him. I did take a very proactive, bold step and I call this like one bold step. You can take one bold step and see if the guy is like, oh, wow, I didn’t even know this was an option for me. So I’m gonna pick up the ball and run with it because What happened? Like, I sent him that message I said it was, you know, it was really nice meeting you and he like responded right away, he commented on something that I said in my bio, he like asked me out to dinner like, you know, it wasn’t like, I didn’t have to pull teeth to get that. keep that going. I was just like, pushing it into motion, because there are guys who are good guys who, like they need a little bit of encouragement. Like he, there was no way that he thought in the three minutes that we interacted, that he’d be like, Oh, let me ask her out. Like, he’s just not that kind of guy. Like, he doesn’t have that kind of game, you know? So, and I could tell that he wasn’t that kind of guy. It wasn’t that he wasn’t confident. I could just tell like, if I’m interested in him, I just need to make sure it’s clear and then see what he does. Now if you meet a guy and the guy is super, like suave, Mr. Cool player type that guy, you don’t need to make a bold move with that guy. Right? Right. And you guy will you be chasing?

Damona 33:57
Yeah, right. And you also have to listen to what’s happening, like so many times I hear from people that like, Oh, I wrote him, but then he didn’t write me back. And I don’t know if I should send another message. And I’m like, why are they responded to?

Unknown Speaker 34:12
He responded with his his silence was a response. It was a response. It was a communication, just looking for.

Damona 34:19
Yeah, well, that’s the problem, right? We have expectations. And then when our expectations aren’t met, then sometimes we try to change the narrative or the information that reinterpret the information that we’re getting. But absolutely, I want to keep this going on a positive note, because I am still optimistic. I am still optimistic about finding love in a pandemic.

Unknown Speaker 34:40
Yeah, and

Damona 34:41
I’ll let everyone check out the blog for the rest of the tips because there’s

Unknown Speaker 34:46
10 of them. They all bear 10 different things as fire right now.

Damona 34:50
This is like all the stuff that I would tell you as well. Like, she literally just gives you the roadmap right there. So we’ll put the link in the show notes. But before we do that, I also want Want to talk about social distance dates? Now I’m seeing a lot of people are like, Okay, what is the timeline here? Now that we’ve we’ve connected? Maybe we’ve done a virtual date or two or phone call and a verge zoomed? I don’t know, connected. But where do we go from here? Mm hmm. Are you finding that people are starting to feel comfortable with moving offline into social distance dates? Yes,

Unknown Speaker 35:26
definitely. Definitely. Yes. At first, it was all virtual. Nobody wanted to go anywhere. People weren’t even discussing it. Really. The possibility of meeting in person. But now Yeah, people are definitely doing socially distance dates and there are ways to do it that are safe. I mean, Okay,

Damona 35:43
tell us about that. Like, what’s the etiquette?

Unknown Speaker 35:46
So like, if I were dating right now, like something that I would do is I would say like, okay, we can meet here and, you know, get a cup of coffee, get an ice cream, get a juice and like, take a walk together, you know, and six feet apart. And yeah, as long as you’re like you’re outside, you know, so there’s airflow. That’s really important. You have a mask on. Right? So that’s also really important.

Damona 36:09
A cute mask. Okay? Don’t just get, you know, the surgical blue and white situation. Yes. Why do you stop a cute mask?

Unknown Speaker 36:18
Yeah, we’re gonna be wearing masks for a long time people. So invest in a couple of masks that really capture your style, your personality, like don’t just do the straight, you know, surgical mask.

Unknown Speaker 36:31
Day. Yeah, that’s a missed opportunity. That’s a missed opportunity.

Damona 36:34
Yes, I love how you said that. Exactly.

Unknown Speaker 36:38
So that you know, so you could do that with lots of different things. So basically, if you’re outside and you could do something like you know mini golf, you don’t have to be you know, you have some space together. Have some space apart. We went to a drive in movie last week. I know you did too. You guys also want to drive in movie,

Damona 36:56
you know, I went to see RuPaul drive and drag Coming to a city near you, everybody. It was okay. But it was nice to be outside. It was a

Unknown Speaker 37:07
movie and it was nice. It was fun.

Damona 37:09
But then you have to be in a car with the person so like we had a whole thing

Unknown Speaker 37:14
you don’t have to be in the car with the person because you guys can park next to each other.

Damona 37:19
Okay, okay I’m with you. I’m with you. Yeah I like I tell I had I went with a friend so I tested before I went and she had like a fairly recent test I was like I can accept this

Unknown Speaker 37:32
but we’re getting a car right now like that’s just don’t just don’t do that aren’t

Damona 37:37
next to each other yet.

Unknown Speaker 37:39
Other timing, you could you could go on a picnic, you could go to you know, you can have a picnic on the beach or in the park. You could go for a hike, like anything that you’re outside. You know if you guys if you happen to like I don’t know like playing tennis and you know, you want to play tennis together. Like there are ways to do it and still be and still be safe now. Does it require a little bit more creativity? Yes. Does it require a little bit more effort? Yes, but it’s worth doing. And, you know, that’s, I mean, listen, love is, and this is my point of the blog too, because I’m not expecting other people to look at this blog and be like, Oh, I’m gonna do all these 10 things if this crazy person would do, but I would do all those 10 things if I was really motivated to be in a relationship, because it’s that important to me, you know. And so if it’s important to you, this pandemic is not going to be over anytime soon. And I wouldn’t be willing to put my dating life My hopes were finding a relationship on hold indefinitely. It’s life is just too short for that. So does it take a little bit more effort? Does it take a little bit more determination? That’s, that’s okay. That’s good. And I mean, I think Dimona, like, wouldn’t you agree that the fact that one of the reasons that modern dating has gotten so challenging Pre pandemic is because there were so many people who weren’t put willing to put in effort. And they weren’t actually determined to meet someone like they wanted to meet someone. But if they got frustrated after a few days, like they were out of there, you know, it’s just there was

Damona 39:15
too much happening where nobody could focus on what was in front of them, I think, yeah, we just we had too many options. And now, I think what I’m seeing is that people are also realizing as we’ve been separated for so long the value of having someone that you can trust to go through this experience with and so now I’m actually seeing a lot of relationships that have been on hyperspeed and people that I mean, we did an episode on this a few months ago of people that really bonded, met right before the pandemic and bonded very quickly, like practically moved in together. And so I think there’s going to be a little bit of recalibration on that front, but the timeline once you connect with people I think is actually going to be faster than it had been. I think we had it backwards before. It was like fast, fast, fast, get to the date like sword, sword, sword, sword sword. But then it was a long time to get to commitment and figuring out what was what for a lot of my clients and really, you know, getting to DTR and figure out if this person was real or not. I think now, we’re we’re flip flopping that so we’re, we’re moving into it a lot more slowly. But then once you are like, Okay, this is my person. Now we have to test we have to bubble together and now now we’re bonded very fast.

Unknown Speaker 40:41
Yeah. And I think that makes sense. And that and that’s why we have been so optimistic, you know, starting starting from the start of this that we’re like, oh my god, this is amazing. This is going to slow everything down and give people an opportunity like force people to actually get to know each other communicate what they’re looking for. See if they have to Shared values, see, and if all of those things are connecting, then it’s like, Alright, well, let’s just do this. Like, we just now we just need to see if we actually, like get along and have chemistry and like being together, and that is something that you can determine rather quickly. It’s those other bigger questions that really take time. So I think that, you know, I think that the relationships, I think that a lot of the relationships that are going to come out of this time are going to really illustrate the power of doing just that. They’re going to be a lot of really great relationships that last with people who they may just have that clarity of knowing, like, yeah, we want the same things in life. Like we have the same level of commitment. And we know how to support each other through challenging times because we were there for each other. Like, this person has a reason that I’m still standing after, you know, however long of this pandemic, so

Damona 41:55
yes, it’s definitely changing things. I just made me think I have to shout out one of My former clients who she actually had a destination wedding plan, and I kid you not Franny a year, a little over a year ago, year and a half ago, she came to me and she was like, I don’t know how I’m going to find love again. I’ve been divorced X number of years. And she found somebody, they were going to have a, a wedding abroad, and COVID happened. So now they’re just like, fine. Let’s just do let’s just do a little ceremony, just with family, tie the knot and get it done. So she’s actually getting married this week. Her name is denat. So I’ll be sharing her story on the blog and I’m sure on the show again, but yeah, you know, that will give everyone some hope that even though Yes, COVID is changing our plans. In some ways. It’s changing for the better now she’s going to be married even sooner than she thought she would be.

Unknown Speaker 42:51
That is fantastic. And I also have a client who got married last week. And yeah, and I’m so glad that they did it because first they were going to Wait. And because they were originally supposed to get married this summer, and then they were going to push it, but they just changed it. Like they just did like a very small ceremony on a Wednesday afternoon, like, with just their immediate family in their front yard like but it was, but it was awesome. And she was someone who had never been in a relationship before we started working together and now she’s married to a wonderful man.

Damona 43:24
I love that. Okay, hopefully that is inspiring for all the people listening. They’re like, I gotta do 10 things.

Unknown Speaker 43:32
Just do things you have to be open, you know, and it’s a mindset because it’s like, it’s not like it’s it’s home. It’s not homework. It’s just like, all right, love this. This is the mind strategy. We would encourage anyone who’s looking for love to just embrace and this is the mindset that I truly did very intentionally and consciously embrace for myself, which is I know that love is 100% possible for me. So my only job is to open my myself up to receive it however it shows up. I know he’s out there. I don’t know where he is. He could be around the corner. It could be I don’t know where he is. So why would I shut down any Avenue a potentially a spining each other?

Damona 44:15
You you are a woman after my own heart.

Unknown Speaker 44:19
Like, why would you do that? Like what? Like why would you just like Intel or willfully just decide like, No, I’m not going to do these and you know a lot of people they consider themselves like, I’m out there I’m trying and then like, Okay, what are you doing? And like they maybe they’re on an app that they swipe a few times a week, and then they get frustrated? And then they made it they deleted it. And then they download it A month later and they

Damona 44:41
complain to their girlfriends about being single.

Unknown Speaker 44:43
Yeah. And I’m like, Well, what else? Like that’s not that’s not being out there? like no, that’s not a job to pay your bills. Is that how you would look for a job? Like no like if you want to if you’re determined like you’re put in the effort.

Damona 44:57
All right, everyone, you heard it here. If you want,

Unknown Speaker 45:01
yep, if you want to find love, you got a date like it’s your job, granny. It’s really it’s your hobby. It’s your passion. It’s exciting. It can be fun. It should be fun, make it fun. Maybe that’s my job. You know? It’s like Yeah, well make it make it a job that you love. How can you make it exciting? How can you be more confident? How can you be more yourself so you take away all of that anxiety of like trying to be something that you think someone else wants? Like, you know, there’s just so many ways to make dating such a more joyful experience. Completely

Damona 45:34
frannie This is too good. Your advice is too good. I need you to stick around for the next segment. Because we have questions from our audience and I need you to help me answer them. Okay. Hello, friend. Welcome back. You have questions. We have answers and this is dear Dimona,

Unknown Speaker 45:58
damona help me

Damona 46:00
This one comes to us in an email from D we’ll call her D. She says is two weeks too soon to start saying I love you. I met someone who is working abroad and we have established quite a nice text relationship. He is head over heels for me and keeps telling me he loves me. We haven’t met yet. I have strong feelings for him, but this is making me uncomfortable. How do I elegantly ask him to slow down?

Unknown Speaker 46:27
This is a tough one. And it’s tough because All right, I’m just gonna be unfiltered here. Okay, is that okay? All we do

Damona 46:36
on this show that

Unknown Speaker 46:38
so it is not a good sign that there’s somebody that you’ve met online, who lives abroad who after two weeks is telling you that he loves you. There are scammers out there who actually you know, prey on people and this is what they do. They do this love bombing thing and they just, they just tell you the greatest thing since sliced bread They know what they’re doing. They know exactly what to say. I’ll just put it this way. If he, he starts saying anything about any kind of financial transaction. Just know that this is not a real person. I mean is a human but not this person is not who you think they are. Did she say that she’s only spoken to him on the phone? text, text? Text chip? Oh, yeah. I mean, at the very least, please insist that you do a video call and see who this person is. Mm hmm. And if this person is actually who they say they are, I would be very surprised, wouldn’t you Dimona?

Damona 47:37
Yeah, and I think there are also some red flags around the if you ask them for a video call. And they only want to do it at weird hours or like, they give all these excuses for why they can’t have their camera on or like anything that makes you feel like this isn’t transparant also sometimes, like an accent that you don’t expect, I’ve heard that happen before. Yeah, I’ve heard

Unknown Speaker 48:07
that happen a lot, right? Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 48:08
you’re like,

Unknown Speaker 48:11
you know, Max, but the accent is clearly not. Yes,

Damona 48:16
yeah, there are a lot of signs here that this could be a catfish. I like to keep it optimistic too. So let’s just say in, in some universe that maybe this person actually is is legit. And like, I find that also in quarantine. People are kind of moving a little bit more quickly when they like I was saying in the first segment in the earlier segment, when you’re, when once you’ve connected with someone, they’re moving things forward too quickly. So if that happens to be the case for D, I would say just be really blunt about how you’re feeling like this is moving way too fast. I need to get to know you better. You don’t have to be elegant about it. You can you can be direct. Anyways, we have another question and we’re running out of time. Franny. She said do you have recommend on physical intimacy, what if you find someone that you would like to start a committed physical relationship with? How do you navigate and set safety agreements? Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 49:12
yeah. Well, I think the question should you have the answer in the in the question, right? Like, it is something to navigate, you do need to have agreements. So you need to talk about it. What’s your comfort level? What are the parameters? You know, when are you guys getting tested with some regularity? How often are you coming into contact with people who aren’t that you know, each other? I those are just all conversations that you have to have. And I would be really clear about it. I wouldn’t, you know, I wouldn’t tiptoe around it. I’d be like, you know, really honest, like, I really want to, you know, I really want to go there. I’ll be like, I’m ready. I think you’re amazing, but how can we do this and really be safe and make sure that we’re taking every precaution to protect each other and, you know, other people think?

Damona 49:59
I think it’s ongoing conversation to like totally. I’ve been hearing from people in relationships that are like, my, my spouse is ready to like move out into the world and I’m still cocooning and nervous. Yeah. And they have different tolerance, risk tolerance. So I think this is a conversation obviously if you can get tested or self quarantine before you actually take the masks off and become intimate with someone and like really think this through what it because once it only takes one it’s kind of like the STI conversation right? It only takes one right One false move exactly one

Unknown Speaker 50:45
time ever and everything is fine. Right? Yeah.

Damona 50:50
Right. So I mean, we live in Los Angeles where we’re testing is free and available. I haven’t even say I tested you know, before I did the ripples drag race I got to same day test producer Leo will attest to this. I got to same day test. I got the next the results by the next morning. It was unbelievable. I know not everybody is in that situation. Yeah. So yeah, it was amazing. You guys. I’m like, I’m like a testing junkie now. I just want to know, I want to know, am I okay? Am I okay? Do it, do it. It’s so great. I mean, if you if you feel like i, this is I do at any time my situation changes, like, if we go out of town, or if like when our babysitter came back, like if your situation changes, it’s a good idea to test if you can get one but if you’re dating someone, and maybe you’re in a state where that’s not available, you have to kind of think ahead of how are you going to prepare right to get to that point. And then you also have to talk about what are they doing after that? Yeah, exactly. Yeah, I tested and I’m fine. And now I’m gonna go to like Abba zoo. And, you know, go chill on a boat with opa.

Unknown Speaker 51:59
While my closest friends

Damona 52:04
I wouldn’t be having that. I’m not gonna judge your life. If that’s how you want you and your boo want to do it, that’s fine. But make sure that you’re on the same page and that you understand their risk tolerance in comparison to yours. Right? Yeah,

Unknown Speaker 52:16
absolutely. Yeah. And that’s another and it’s also it’s it can it has for some people, like you said, become a bone of contention. You know, if you can’t agree on the rules, if they’re, I mean, I had a client who was dating somebody who he was, you know, she has she’s immunocompromised. She was just concerned about her own health, for obvious reasons. Yeah. And they had, they were, they were seeing each other and they physically were seeing each other. They were seeing each other like a couple of nights a week. But then she found out that he was like, having friends over to his apartment and all these things and she’s like, that’s not what we agreed to, you know, and it and it became like, they actually like stop seeing each other.

Unknown Speaker 52:57
I call this COVID cheating, like infidelity right there is total

Unknown Speaker 53:01
code infidelity. And she was like, I’m not taking like, you know, she felt very disrespected. And yeah, they weren’t able to reconcile it. So that is a real possibility. But I think that you know, just talking about it, just being really honest with each other is the way to go.

Damona 53:17
That is the way to go for most relationship challenges I really

Unknown Speaker 53:21
can’t always answer

Damona 53:25
all of your answers. I love your uncommon conversations about love on dear frannie and

Unknown Speaker 53:30
I love it when you join us here on dates and mate. So I hope you will come back again soon. Anytime. I love being here. Thank you for having me. demona

Damona 53:38
I hope you like the new intro for deer demona the beautiful soulful voice you heard was my dear friend Jenny Wren, and also thank you Alexander, for your wonderful question. Dear Dimona cries. We heard you we’ve listened and also shout out to our composers James Morris for the brand new dates and mates intro and for the deer demona Intro This is Episode 322 of dates and mates. My guest co host today both have fabulous podcasts that you just have to hear. You can find frannie on deer frannie uncommon conversations about love and barns and his crew are the Pop Culture Show. Look for the links in the show notes and find it wherever you are listening to this podcast right now. As always, we’ll give you a shortcut to today’s headline articles, and the best gifts that are fit to print on the show recap at dates and mates calm. And don’t forget to check out that Patreon group and support the show for just $5 at patreon.com slash dates and mates. You don’t want to miss that new behind the mic series and meet other folks in the Friends with Benefits community. So come on aboard@patreon.com slash dates and mates. I’m at damona Hoffman on all the socials. We are banking all these questions you have for future episodes. So don’t be shy DM me and let me know what’s on your mind and how you felt about today’s episode. I’ll see you next week with more modern love advice. Until then, I wish you happy dating

Transcribed by https://otter.ai