Dating Transformation & Gray Divorce
YOUR DATING PROFILE ISNāT ABOUT YOU
Donāt know who needs to hear this, but your dating profile isnāt for you. Itās to attract your ideal match.ā
Donāt just take our word for it. This week, Connell Barrett, official dating coach for The League, joins Damona on Dates & Mates to talk about attracting authentic love and how to spot a fake from a mile away.
The first step to finding real love? Think of your dating app as a digital marketing platform. More on that later, first Damona covers headlines:
DATING DISH (1:27)
(1:30) The Gray Gates Divorce
You donāt need a crystal ball to foresee Bill and Melinda Gates heading into a rather rough divorce. However, many couples of Bill and Melindaās age range are also looking to separate and lead new lives. Damona shares a look into the āGray Divorce Trendā.
(6:08) A new study from Ashley Madison on how faith and infidelity intersect.
Ashley Madison, the dating site for those seeking extramarital affairs, conducted a study on the crux of faith and infertility. Surprising: more than a third of Ashley Madison users identify as religious.
HOW TO ATTRACT AUTHENTIC LOVE (10:39)
Connell Barrett is the Founder of Dating Transformation and the official dating coach for The League. Heās a dating coach for men who is on a mission to help you find your soulmate as your most authentic, confident self. Youāve seen him on Access Hollywood, the Today show, Good Morning LA, and Playboy and now heās here on Dates & Mates:
(10:39) They call him Hitch: Connell shares what inspired him to enter the world of being a dating coach.
(11:30) Confessions from inside the world of pick up artists and how to spot a fake from a mile away. āNeggingā? āPeacocking?ā Oh my.
(16:17) Being your authentic self actually relates to how you feel about getting your coffee from Starbucks. You can be magnetic to others in ways you probably didnāt realize, particularly being your true, authentic self.
(20:51) Be radically authentic. Connell believes that online dating is really just digital marketing. It doesnāt actually become dating until you have a phone call or meet your match in person. You have to offer your matches something of value and be genuine.
(25:45) Connell dives deep into the world of why men do the things they do. Why is it so hard to read their minds and understand their actions?
(28:35) Connell reveals that he actually used to feel unattractive to women. He shares on how he was able to change the way he felt about himself by discovering his worth.
(32:51) Dating is now more about simple pick-up lines. Itās about creating meaningful conversations. Be transparent about what you are thinking and feeling. Connell believes it is so important to be as honest and real as you can be.
(39:05) Men are now often unsure of how to navigate the dating world because of the Me Too Movement. Connell shares his advice on men honoring a woman while letting them know they are interested. It is so important to understand how a manās actions make a woman feel and calibrate accordingly.
Get Connellās Book āDating Sucks, But You Donātā using Damonaās Amazon Link or wherever you get your books!
DEAR DAMONA (46:30)
Submit your questions on Instagram, Twitter, or Facebook and hear our answers live on the show! Hereās what our listeners asked about this week:
- (Brittany) Hi Damona! Question for you: how do I avoid coming off as āmore of a friendā on dates? Iāve had no less than 7 people tell me āyouāre great, we have a ton in common, I love hanging with you, BUT only as a friendā and I donāt know what Iām doing wrong. I normally wouldnāt bla-me myself at all, but it keeps happening! Do I need to state more clearly at the beginning that I only want a relationship? Why is this such a commonly-used strategy to reject someone?
- (Alex) Hi Damona! I will tell you my story. I work at the hotel and I met a guy here. He is a returning guest, coming every 2 or 3 weeks. After his 3rd time, he gave me his business card to text him. And i knew it was coming bc that day there was a lot of chemistry in the air. So I texted him, and we met 2 times. Itās kind of hard to meet here, and moreover i should not have done it because heās a guest. somehow this whole thing got more exciting. So I felt we made a connection and got a little bit intimate. And heās really great, we have a lot in common. But we were always in touch when he was at the hotel, never when he was not around. Last time when we were saying goodbye we said to stay in touch. But we did not. He checked in yesterday and I feel thereās sth wrong. He didnāt text me before. When we talked, it was very formal, he was nice, told me that itās good to see me and how iām doing but thatās all. Am i being ghosted? i know that it was very casual but i donāt feel good about it. I donāt know what happened. But the worst thing is that I cannot ask for an explanation, right? we were not together or exclusive. We were just hanging out. Moreover, I found out that next week thereās another reservation under the same surname with a female name. Is this his family, wife? What the heck is happening? Btw i love your podcasts!
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WANNA GO MORE IN-DEPTH? FOLLOW ALONG:
Damona 0:01
itās your certified Dating Coach damona Hoffman here with another episode presented by text now, the app that gives you a free second phone number for dating so you donāt have to give out your primary number to all your matches ever had to change your number because you gave it to a weirdo and then regretted it. It sucks, right? Well, text now weāll help you with that. Speaking of things that suck about dating, I hear this from daters all the time. Lots of people tell me dating socks Dimona. And I know it can suck if you donāt have the right mindset or tools, or if you donāt feel like youāre lucky in love. So today Iām talking to Connell Barrett, official dating coach for the league. and author of the new book dating sucks,
Connell Barrett 0:43
but you donāt.
Damona 0:44
Heās going to share all about his method using the power of radical authenticity, speaking my language, and some little tricks from the world of pickup artistry to attract your best match. But first, we have these headlines of really big news and some surprising revelations about the Bill and Melinda Gates divorce. And a shocking new study from Ashley Madison on how faith and infidelity intersect. Then in dear demand, Iāll answer questions from you like how to stop getting friendzone after a date, and is the guy youāre casually seeing secretly married. Itās going to be another action packed episode of dates and mates and now we dash
Connell Barrett 1:31
Well,
Damona 1:31
Iām not the one breaking the news to you that Bill and Melinda Gates are divorcing? I hope not. I mean, maybe youāve been living under a rock. No, you have it. Youāre a database listener you know whatās happening? Yes, Bill and Melinda Gates are divorcing, you know, Bill, of course, as co founder of Microsoft, Melinda Gates, an early employee there. And the two of them together have built this huge philanthropic arm with the Bill and Melinda with the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation that has done a lot to to tackle things like getting people clean water, and vaccines and so many other really important issues. So this divorce is big news, not just for their relationship, itās big news in business. Itās big news in for causes around the world. And itās got me of course asking the questions like what the heck happened? I actually think that this divorce is not really going to be resolved for many years, even though they have a prenup. Because the challenge is the prenup. Of course, theyāve been married for 27 years. So the prenup was originally written before they built so much of this together. And itās really about protecting the assets that you bring into the relationship. But what do they have, like thereās such an argument there for Melinda being a part of helping bill build the Microsoft fortune both as a former employee and then as her as his spouse. So this is going to be hella complicated. But just to add an additional element to this, that there was a revelation recently that in the prenup, they also included things about each otherās personal behaviors. For example, Bill Gates was allowed according to this prenup to spend one week a year with his ex girlfriend at her beach house, her in sheās married to so thereās all these things when you start to peel back the layers you think you know people and you see them out there like doing good in the world and creating and growing this ridiculous fortune that they are seemingly using to give back to to make the world a better place. But you donāt know really whatās going on behind closed doors. And that to me, even if you had an understanding about it 27 years ago, thereās probably so many things that have been complicated over the years that eventually got to be too much. So this is probably going to be one of the most expensive divorces weāve ever seen. Iām sure it itās going to take some time to unravel all that apparently bill just like wrote just handed over. Apparently bills is handed over $2 million 2 billion. Wait, how much? 2 billion. Shit shit. Oh my gosh. Apparently bill just transferred almost $2 billion. Thatās billion with a B I had to double check it $2 billion in stock tumbled to Melinda on the day she filed for divorce which of course was a little bit before we found out about it but that makes me that feels like an apology. payment or something, I donāt know, I think thereās going to be more information. Maybe
by the time this airs, thereāll be more information thatās come out. But they are on trend. There is a trend now for what theyāre calling gray divorce or splitting after the age of 50. Itās more than doubled in recent decades. And I donāt necessarily think this is a bad thing, because I actually think itās about people really getting clear getting clear on what they want. And youāve heard me say on the show before it my prediction is that coming out of the pandemic, which we unfortunately are not out of yet, we are going to see more and more divorces. Because this pandemic has had an unintended benefit, I guess, of helping many people clarify whatās really important to them, what are we living for? What do you want to do with your life? And who do you want to spend it with? And if youāre not with that person, and if youāre not living your life, in integrity, with what your values are, and what you ultimately want to do to make your mark on this world, then it might be time to reevaluate and move on. Some folks are out here reevaluating before theyāve moved on, though, we actually got our hot little hands on a hot little study from Ashley madison.com. Ashley Madison is the app or website dating site that is for people who are seeking extramarital affairs. Iām sure youāve heard of it. But what you havenāt heard is this study called the crux of infidelity, where Ashley Madison looked at the relationship between faith and adultery. And there was some some info in here that I did not expect to see. Turns out 66% of Ashley Madison members, only only two sexes have a religious affiliation with only 17% identifying as atheist or agnostic. And a lot of them said that their religion is important to them, or is the center of their lives more than a third. And yet there were also people in this study who said that feeling guilty or ashamed for having an affair is linked to religion. And many of them said that they didnāt agree with the religious teachings that were taught to them. As many, many of them said they didnāt agree with some of their religious teachings things like no sex before marriage, sex is only for procreation, discouragement of female pleasure or sexuality. I could go on and on sexual exclusivity with your spouse, adultery is a sin, basically all of the things
Connell Barrett 7:41
that
Damona 7:42
are part of adultery as it relates to the 10 commandments and other other passages of the Bible, which Iāll admit I donāt know very well. But most of them didnāt believe that their religion should revise its doctrine on these teachings. And this is kind of another example of likes, do what I do, as I say, not as I do. And it reminded me also like how much shame we all carry for these decisions that we think other people are doing, or we think weāre supposed to do, but that are not ultimately what we want or what we need. So Iām not Iām not sitting here saying like, you know, just throw caution to the wind and go have an affair, everybody. Itās not what Iām saying at all. Iām just saying that itās interesting to see how much our actions sometimes are not in alignment with our thoughts, our feelings, our words, even. And itās interesting, I was listening to some I was listening to a special episode of death, sex and money Anna sale. The host of that show, if you know it from wnyc, NPR, itās amazing. Sheās going to be on the show in a few weeks talking about her new book. But Anna Sayle did an interview with Dan Savage who is very vocal about ethical non monogamy. And he was saying that so many of us are like, I would take a bullet for my spouse or my partner like I would do anything Iād take a bullet for them. And he was saying that infidelity is that bullet that that most couples are going to be touched by infidelity. He said, basically, 50% of men and 50% of women are unfaithful in their relationship. And theyāre not necessarily the same people so that almost all couples are in some way at some time. Touched by infidelity. And the question is, what do you do? What do you do when that happens? I do get a lot of questions from people like Iām afraid to commit to this relationship because what if what if heās unfaithful? or What is it? What does it mean to make this vow and what if I have an attraction to someone else, and to me, it keeps coming back to being in alignment, being in alignment with your goals and your values, and sometimes the religious teachings that we follow, we think theyāre in alignment, because thatās what weāve always known. And yet, when we dig a level deeper, weāre not actually even operating our lives in accordance with what we thought we believed. So thereās a brain bender for you. Now you have options now you have information. And now you have a lot to think about as we head into our first break when we come back. Connell Barrett will be here talking about his new book dating sucks, but you donāt stick around. Weāre back and Iām here with Connell Barrett. Heās the founder of dating transformation and the official dating coach for the league. Donāt worry, weāre not going to duke it out and a dating app battle. Heās a dating coach for men who is on a mission to help you find your soulmate as your most authentic, confident self. Youāve seen him on access hollywood, the today show good day LA and playboy. And now Iām excited for you to give big smooches to my guests. Cardinal Barrett,
Connell Barrett 11:11
Jonah, thank you so much for having me. Iām psyched to be here.
Damona 11:14
I feel like weāve been courting for quite a while and now itās finally here. Itās our first dance.
Connell Barrett 11:20
The dance continues.
Connell Barrett 11:22
Okay,
Damona 11:23
I I want to go back in time to like the beginning of like, where this all this whole dating coach journey started for you. Because I hear you have some secrets. I donāt want to call them rules of the game. But do you know a little bit about the game? Do you not?
Connell Barrett 11:42
I do I do. I remember reading that book the game Neil Straussās book the game back in 2005 2006. And that was what sparked me on this realization that Oh, you can learn about dating and quote unquote, attracting women. And I guess what Iāll do is try a bunch of tricks like the game talks about and negs and everything. So
Damona 12:08
thatās the top trick. So it itās this might be new to some people. You just threw out regs tell everybody what an egg is. I just talked about it on the Drew Barrymore show but tell everybody what an egg
Connell Barrett 12:19
Oh, good. An egg is something that pick up old school pickup artists used to do and some of them still teach it, where you try to make your the woman youāre talking to feel insecure about herself, and self conscious. So you quote, lower her self confidence so that then she wants to seek your approval. So for example, if if a pickup artist was talking to a woman who had slightly crooked, imperfect teeth, he might say, Oh, I really like your teeth. I was always a big Bugs Bunny fan. So he would try to make herself conscious about herself so that she would then try to seek His approval. Itās really gross.
Damona 12:57
Itās really gross, but it works. Why do you think it? It does? legitimately I would never tell any of my listeners to do it. And yet Iāve seen that it works time and time again. And that was the thing like on the Drew Barrymore show that I was telling this this lady is that she was almost inviting nagging, she was like taking this antagonistic stance with a lot of guys in the messages that they were sending back and forth. And Iām like, why does that work?
Connell Barrett 13:24
Well, in Mike, I never really got good at negging I never did it. I never liked it. So I donāt have a lot of first hand experience with it. But I think it works because people are insecure, we all are to an extent, we all doubt our self confidence, our our Am I enough pneus. And if you talk to somebody and make them feel a little bit insecure, and they want your validation back, then I could see where tricks like that would work. But they never worked for me. I went out and tried to I tried them for a little bit. I tried being an alpha male aihole I tried to be I tried lines, I tried a lot of scripted moves. And what I found was that when I finally dropped those things, and I finally, I finally said, You know what, Iām just gonna be vulnerable and authentic and as awesome as I can be. That works so much better. Just really what Iām about. Itās about all of the things that pickup artists teach some men to do. Theyāre teaching men to do an impersonation of a cool, high value, amazing guy. And I say, why not just become a high value authentically amazing guy, or girl.
Damona 14:27
Boom, drop the mic right there. Iām with you.
Connell Barrett 14:30
Thanks for having me. Iām gonna take off.
Damona 14:32
It is all about authenticity, but I want to kind of understand some of those techniques a little bit deeper and why they donāt why they do or donāt work and then like what the alternative option would be. So another term thatās thrown around is peacocking. Right? So peacocking thatās, thatās sort of like wearing something flamboyant or doing something that gets people to notice you. What like Why? Two things two,
Connell Barrett 15:05
thereās two reasons why peacocking can work. One is because you stand out, youāre wearing a bright yellow shirt, or a top hat or something really over the top, in a public place, youāre going to look different than every other person. And thatās going to get attention. So attention can be good. So it gets eyes on you, it gets a womanās eyes on you. And then but the idea of peacocking is kind of its kind of devious hits, the idea is you want people to call you on on your outfit, you want them to mock you, or come up and tease you. And then you pass that test, you keep your cool, you let it brush off you. And a woman might see that and say, oh, that guy doesnāt give a shit. He can handle social pressure. So itās actually it creates an opportunity to get a womanās attention and also pass the social tests of people mocking you for your clothing. That again, thatās the idea. But itās another gimmick that is designed to paper over the real issues, the real wounds that people have. I say fix those wounds. Donāt wear a loud yellow shirt or medallions. Unless youāre just a medallion person.
Damona 16:13
Then you know, just do you, boo.
Connell Barrett 16:15
But yeah, letās
Damona 16:16
dig into that a little bit. Because you you talk in your new book, dating sucks, but you donāt. The modern guys guide to total competence, romantic connection and finding the perfect partner. You talk about being magnetic as you even if youāre not rich, tall or great looking
Connell Barrett 16:33
how?
Damona 16:34
Iām sure there are people listening right now that are like, Iām not really sure how to be magnetic. How do I draw the people in if Iām not doing the peacocking or the negging? Or like these loud, flamboyant things that are really a cover for some of those, those deeper layers?
Connell Barrett 16:53
Yeah, the idea is to be what I call radically authentic. And that doesnāt make you magnetic to every person. However, what it does, is it makes you incredibly attractive and magnetic to the kind of person who likes your type. I think of it like this. Do you go to Starbucks?
Damona 17:10
All the time. All the time. I used to work there even I was a barista.
Connell Barrett 17:14
Okay. All right.
Connell Barrett 17:15
Do you guys too much information. Do you?
Connell Barrett 17:19
Do you love Starbucks? Like itās the greatest place on earth? Or is it just fine because the coffeeās there and itās convenient. Itās good.
Damona 17:27
I love Starbucks. And please, before yāall start sending me hate mail, I have my reasons. But I love Starbucks.
Connell Barrett 17:35
Okay, fair enough. So youāre not helping me with my, my teachable moment? Well, hereās my view. My view is that most people donāt love Starbucks. Itās fun. Itās convenient. Okay. However, when I was in grad school, when I was in grad school, I was a TA. And there was this coffee bar called the Lakota there was sawdust on the floor. A Bulldog with the owner had was always running around, it was a little bit too loud, a little bit too hipsterish. And I just love that place because it was quirky, and specific, and incredibly authentic for what it was trying to be. Now people, a lot of people hated Lakota. But the people who loved it really loved it. It was just it felt like home and it felt like home for me. And thatās sort of my view of dating, itās you donāt want to be Starbucks. You donāt want to be a watered down wine spritzer. You want to be the cool, quirky hipster coffee shop, or a stiff drink of scotch. Not everybody likes scotch. Not everybody likes that hipster coffee shop, but people who love it are gonna wear the T shirt. Theyāre gonna be there everyday, theyāre gonna tell their friends about it. So the way to become magnetic in the dating landscape, is you lean 1,000% into your avatar, who you are your core, this authentic self that Aristotle talked about. And you show that vulnerability, you lean into that self, and you will definitely not attract everybody. But youāre going to, youāre going to drive about 1/3 to 1/4 of the single people you meet crazy, theyāre going to love you and youāre going to be magnetic to them. So youāre not going to be magnetic to everybody. Be magnetic to people who want to drink at your coffee shop, which in your case is Starbucks but fine. But
Connell Barrett 19:21
see, the thing is, though, I
Damona 19:22
think I think I actually proved your point. Because people are polarized. There are people that hate Starbucks. And you know, like some people also want a Starbucks, like I would say my husbandās kind of a Starbucks, like, you know, heās just like really reliable. Heās like, not too extreme one way or another. And heās a Starbucks, but heās authentically a Starbucks. Like heās not a Starbucks trying to be what was named your coffee shop.
Connell Barrett 19:49
Lakota,
Damona 19:50
Lakota, and I think like, thatās the thing that the pickup artists community missed, right. Theyāre trying to make everybody Lakota itās like some people just stop Thatās,
Connell Barrett 20:00
itās fine. Absolutely.
Damona 20:03
I really take your point. And, and I can also, I can also back it up with data from dating apps. I know, my audience knows, like how nerdy I am about dating apps. But, you know, thereās also information out there that supports that in terms of swiping, people are more likely to swipe on someone who is polarizing, like the people who are polarizing get more engagement than the people who are just like the middle of the road Starbucks, they get more engagement. And that is a strategy that Iāve used for a long time like to say where youāre weird, like to really have those, the color, context and character and Iām like, the characters the thing that most people miss, but that, you know, Iām talking specifically from my dating app experience. I know you also work with a dating app, you work with the league, which is, you know, a swiping app aimed at high achievers.
Connell Barrett 21:03
And thatās how we talk at the league. We are quite distinguished gentlemen. And ladies,
Damona 21:10
what would you say? How does that apply? As you see it in the online dating world? The the philosophy of really being your authentic self? And how do you bring that through in your profile,
Connell Barrett 21:22
itās the same concept. Thatās whatās so great about this idea of being radically authentic. Iām not saying thereās not some differences in context. But I think of online dating, I think thereās a big myth about online dating. Itās not really dating. Itās marketing. Itās not dating until you talk the first time or meet or at least have that first phone conversation or date. Until that point, itās just marketing, itās digital marketing, and what works with digital marketing. Two things, you have to break through the noise, you have to send a signal thatās just different and captures peopleās attention and cuts through the noise. And that offers the offers them something offers them something of value, something they want a date, a hookup a makeout, a, somebody to text on a lonely lockdown night, whatever theyāre looking for, give them something of value. So when Iām helping clients on the league, or my own clients, men and women, increase their matches increase the quality of the men and women they match with. Iām looking at it as a marketer. Iām saying, Hey, your profile might feature you, but itās not about you. Itās profiles about the other person on the other end of their phone swiping. Itās about her or him. Itās about making them feel the way we want them to feel, again, in an authentic way, but in a very value offering way. And sometimes when I say the word marketing, some people think Well, isnāt that canāt thatās kind of like pickup artists, right? Isnāt marketing sketchy? Isnāt it like used car salesman? And I donāt think so I think really good. Value Added marketing, where you feel like the company knows you likes you. Theyāre, theyāre being transparent. I think that itās about connection. And itās about a highly specific message. So what I have people do the guys I work with, I say, Who are you? I recently asked my client Jeremy, who are you? Who are you are your core because he wrote his bio up. And it was basically he was suffering from long walks on the beach, itis it was just like, I like travel and the beach. Iām like, come on, dude, who are you really? Who are you in two or three words? He said, Iām a man of extremes. Like cool. What does that mean? Heās like, I love plunge pools, and sleep deprivation chambers. And I buy seven books at a time and only read one of them like, yes, thatās the guy. We want women to
Damona 23:42
say swipe left. But there are other people.
Connell Barrett 23:46
Others we say no turn
Connell Barrett 23:47
on site as edgy.
Connell Barrett 23:49
Exactly. We donāt want to try to be all things to all people because then theyāll swipe left. We want. We want a solid percentage of people to be like, right, right, right. Right now, on my dating profile, I say Iām a dating coach. Iām like hitch, itās very polarizing. Some women are suspicious, Iām gonna like it. But itās who I am. And itās different. Itās different. So we want to find that unique difference and market yourself to people in a way thatās genuine, but also offers value and makes them go, Oh, this is not something I see. Every day on the apps.
Damona 24:22
Yeah, I agree with you. And wrote a similar book on the topic on how to brand yourself, which is kind of the same thing. Yeah. Right. Same reaction. And this was like 10 years ago, same reaction, like people are like, what? No, this is about me being authentically me, which it is. But itās also about like, think of it from the other personās perspective. This is what I want everybody to really, really hear men and women right now hear what Connell just said. He said, think of it from the perspective of the person looking at the profile, not just like, this is me. This is who I am, you know, like it, you know, swipe left. Thatās not what it is. Itās about really thinking like, what? also is that person? What does that person need to see to swipe? Right, right?
Connell Barrett 25:07
Yes, exactly thinking about the audience. Your podcast is awesome as it is as awesome as you are, you probably donāt think of it as being about you. Itās really about your audience about what you want them to experience. Right? Same with your book completely.
Connell Barrett 25:21
Itās not my book. My book is not about me. Itās Iām all over it. But itās more about what my book can do for single dudes. And your book was about what your book could do for single people. And your podcast is about what your podcast can offer. So it really comes down to offering value. And thatās kind of what this is about offering relevant value to somebody who likes your your type.
Damona 25:44
I love this. Okay, letās take things then to the next level Connell.
Connell Barrett 25:49
Because possible, can we go deeper?
Connell Barrett 25:51
We can, we can.
Connell Barrett 25:54
Because
Damona 25:56
thereās something else that thereās something else that you address in your book. And, and in in your talks and everything that you all the day and all your things, in the motivation behind peopleās actions. And, you know, we have a lot of folks listening this show that are like, I canāt stand the dating apps, because I donāt understand why people act the way they do. Like, why do you guys match with you but not right? Why do you guys like engage and then pull away? away? Like, why do they say they want a relationship? But then they then they donāt?
Connell Barrett 26:35
What? Men do these things? I canāt believe it.
Damona 26:39
Please explain. Please. A voice of man. Why do you do be doing this?
Connell Barrett 26:45
Letās start with whatās the most common complaint you hear from women that Why do men do what is it ghosting, pull away? show interest pullback? Yeah, why
Damona 26:55
are they hot and cold? Like why canāt I read his actions, I donāt know what he wants.
Connell Barrett 27:04
Got it. I think itās because every weāre all driven by the same. Weāre all driven by the same small subset of needs. And a woman might be on a dating app, and she might be driven for connection. She wants love. She wants an incredible guy to share her life with. And a lot of men are not driven by that. First and foremost, theyāre driven by the need to feel significant to feel sexy to feel validated. So if a woman looking for love and connection, matches what the guy starts messaging feels like heās on the same page. And he gets that validation. Maybe they make out, hook up, or Hello, maybe they just swapped some messages and he feels handsome and sexy. He gets that feeling he wants special. Iām hot, Iām sexy, Iām attractive. I know this feeling because I never felt hot, sexy or attractive. Until my mid 30s. Thatās why I went on this journey because I needed to feel special and attractive. We all do. So for the most part, itās not bad intentions. Itās that we have kind of mismatched needs a womanās looking for connection and, and maybe a soulmate. And a guy who pulls back is probably he might tell her heās interested in that because, you know, itās dating. Heās gonna say what heās gonna say. But really, he just wants that adrenaline rush of an attractive woman to be into him. And then itās like, itās like, a sugar rush. Itās like ego candy. Itās like candy to the ego. Itās like, Oh, thatās all good. Whoās next? Whoās my next? validation rush? So thatās why men do that a lot. Not all men, of course. But many men are wired that way.
Damona 28:38
You said something profound, and then you scan it read past it. You said that you used to not feel attractive. And thatās what sent you on this journey. Iām curious what shifted? Like, was it just about the work that you did? The inner work? Do you feel like for me, Iām just gonna throw this out here personal share time. I found I too, can relate Connell that I didnāt feel attractive. Particularly no offense against the Midwest is my home region. But like standard. Youāre in Ohio.
Connell Barrett 29:14
I was Iām from Ohio. Iām in New York. But I know Ohio and Indiana.
Damona 29:18
Well, Iām Iām originally from Michigan, I went to school in Chicago and the standard of beauty there. Letās just letās just call a spade a spade. At the time that I lived there. The standard of beauty was very different. And the people who were in my circle like because dating apps hadnāt been invented. Then I had a very limited pool of possible matches. Then finally, when I moved to California, and one there were people who were who saw me in a different light. And also I went I started doing I was very early adopter of online dating. And I started to see that there I started to have access to this pool of people who were interested in me Then it started to change actually my self image. And it was also partnered, I would say, with deep self worth worth work, too. But I, I do feel like the availability of matches who were appropriate for me, was a part of me shifting the way that I felt. Did that happen for you at all in that way? Or was it a different kind of experience?
Connell Barrett 30:25
It was similar it took, I think it might have taken me longer than it took you based on what I know about you and what you just shared. So I, I came from a place of very low place in terms of my feelings about my attractiveness to women. I thought I just wasnāt that guy who women went for as I never had a date in high school, barely dated in college, and this content, and then I got when I found when I finally found a woman who wanted to be with me. Sheās a wonderful person, donāt get me wrong, but she wasnāt the right person for me. And I married her. And nine weeks later, she left me. And for a guy who she was hooking up with not, she shouldnāt have gotten married either. Neither of us wanted to. hereās the hereās a phrase you never want to hear. As a newlywed. I heard this, a guy said to me, a friend said this at night where I was working at the time. Hey, I saw your wife on the back of another guyās Harley today.
Damona 31:21
Oh, thatās a whole mouthful.
Connell Barrett 31:23
Thatās a lot to hear. Iām like four weeks married. So after my marriage ended, I felt really low. I felt rejected by all women. And what what shifted in me is it. I didnāt realize I needed this at the time. But I just needed to go on this journey of meeting lots of people, lots of women, and finding out Oh, I have worth I have romantic value in their eyes and some of their eyes. And it took a lot longer than I thought it would have because you know, you know how deeply beliefs can get grooved into your marrow, how it can feel like bone deep. It took me several years of approaching and dating and just learning about how this all works. Where I finally realized, Hey, Iām good enough, I have that worth in value. So the shift for me happened a lot more slowly than I wanted it to at the time. But the silver lining is I got all these great stories and experiences and epiphanies. And it turned me into a dating coach because only by having every single problem that a single man has ever had, can I now feel like I can fix just about any problem that a single man has, because I had them all and fixed them all. So itās like Jon Bon Jovi seen a million problems and rock them all.
Damona 32:39
You got to go through it to be able to relate to it. Certainly. Thereās another part of your book dating sucks, but
Connell Barrett 32:46
you donāt.
Damona 32:48
That I really, I want to also dive into because we talked about, like pickup artists and how they you know, you mentioned approaches like how itās kind of always the same. You do your reps you Oh, you know, you always follow the same pattern. But I I imagine now, especially because we have so many different ways to me with the technology, that that strategy has shifted a little bit. And itās really more about creating authentic conversations. But that is something that is so hard for so many people, especially in the digital world, I get a lot of questions on the show, from people that are like, what do I say, to in the first message, what do I say on the first date. And as someone who is also interested in authentic conversations and connections, Iād love to know your tips for being able to move into a conversation like that.
Connell Barrett 33:48
Yeah, mice, the simple Zen phrase I give my clients and I would give this to women as well, this advice goes to all of us is itās the simple phrase of what Iām thinking and feeling is what Iām saying and doing. When I go on a date and I have one in two hours. When I go on a date. I always try to lean into this idea of Alright, what am I thinking and feeling right now being really transparent, not vulgar. Hopefully, if what Iām thinking is x rated, I might dial it down to a PG, but Iām going to be as honest and real as I can. And what happens is youāre right. I think that maybe the most common question I see and get and here is some variation of what do you say? What are the words that will get them attracted to me that will make it go well? And I answer well starts with think donāt think impress think Express, expressing yourself. Youāre going to be at your most attractive self if youāre expressing your true thoughts and showing your true sense of humor, cracking your versions of jokes. Iām Iām a dad joke guy. Iām not even a dad, but I love dad jokes. My day. Tonightās probably gonna hear Dad jokes. Sheās gonna hear me nerd out a little bit. I
Damona 35:04
may not know I want a dad joke, Connell.
Connell Barrett 35:08
Donāt do that. My command has to be in the moment.
Damona 35:12
Do it on command. But I get it. I donāt want to put you on the spot. I do actually. Actually. Fun fact, my friend. Ah, this is just like a separate. Separate Fun fact. My friend Adrian cope, wrote a book of dad jokes last year. I got one for my dad and for my husband, and itās fabulous. So if you need a primer, like definitely look up Adrian cubs. Dad jokes book.
Connell Barrett 35:38
I will. I need more. Dad, I need I need a dad joke on command. You will
Damona 35:42
never run out. I
Connell Barrett 35:44
blanked on the dad joke.
Damona 35:46
No, no, itās all good. But weāll just cut that out. Thatās all
Connell Barrett 35:49
good. Well, what the in the first chapter of my book I talked about this guy can a guy used to work with and Ken came to me because he was pushing 30 and he had never even kissed a girl never even kissed a woman. Because he was a little bit chubby, shorter than average. He just felt like oh, Iām not that guy. girls go for and he had read the game. He was doing all these pickup artists things and just was making things worse. And I took him out. This is the weekend I really fell in love with being a coach took them out on the town in New York City for a few days. And I kind of realized who can is can can quote Plato and Aristotle. Heās a college professor. He most guys can quote Homer Simpson. You know he can Odyssey? The Odyssey Homer? Anyway, so Ken and I go out and I say lean into that nerdy heās a knock knock joke, man. Heās like, tell girls knock knock jokes. Talk about Plato talk about Aristotle. And for the first time in his life that night, he was having women like grab his phone saying, you better call me. Hereās my number. And we went to this rooftop bar. And I watched him approach a tall, beautiful woman who kind of looked like a Gwyneth Paltrow thing wasnāt her but it looked like her. And I watched I was watching from afar doing the whole hitch dating coach thing. And they were talking for five or 10 minutes and all of a sudden, theyāre kissing. Iām watching. For the first time in my life. Iām knowingly watching somebody have the very first kiss of their life. When he had, he had to get up on his toes because sheās like, 510 and heās, he looked heās kind of a shorter Jonah Hill looking guy. And then they got married a week later. Just kidding. They didnāt get it was just it was just
Damona 37:31
like hanging on every word youāre saying. Like it
Connell Barrett 37:33
was just it was just a drunken makeout but it was actually a lot more than that. Because that weekend can realize you know what, when I really lean into that nerdy Plato quoting, knock knock jokes out and die. Heās gonna find a Gwyneth Paltrow type whoās like, I like cute nerds, Iāll make out with this guy. And thatāll change your life and night like that. And it did for him, I like to think. And so yeah, lead into that if Ken canāt do an impression of some pickup artists it comes across, itās like wearing an ill fitting suit. But when youāre wearing your real skin, your real suit, it fits well. You feel good in it. And that more that that genuinely magnetic side of you comes out. So you can kiss Gwyneth Paltrow look alikes, or whoever your type is.
Damona 38:21
Right. Iām like, I wonder what happened after that to Ken? Like, did he end up with more like a, you know, Iām like, trying to think of another type out. Look, I
Connell Barrett 38:32
just got
Connell Barrett 38:35
a really cool girl right now. Ken is I havenāt talked to Ken in a while. But I know, I know. He was in a relationship about six months later.
Connell Barrett 38:43
He doesnāt need you anymore.
Connell Barrett 38:47
Thatās the whole point. Right?
Damona 38:48
Right. I feel that too. Like thereās so many clients that Iāve launched to help launch into relationships, that itās just like, I donāt ever want to hear from you again. I want you to go and like live your happy life. And you know, Iām here if you need me, but I want I want you to spread your relationship wings and fly.
Connell Barrett 39:06
You are a jet I
Damona 39:08
one last thing, since you are a dating coach for men. And I do hear this. I literally just heard this last week Connell. Like, gosh, itās so hard to know what to say now because of me too. And I donāt know what I can say to a woman and have it not be offensive. There has to there has to be another there has to be a more conscious way to think of this. This whole me to what how do you how do you honor a woman but also let her know that youāre interested?
Connell Barrett 39:43
Right often that balance? Yeah, yeah, great question. First thing men need to do is, is realize that me too is not about the man. Itās about. Not you know, itās not itās itās me to not you to the man to So first of all, Just donāt be that guy who says youāre gonna have to make the first move because I donāt want to, you know, itās a different culture. And this is the whole point. The whole point is, letās honor and respect women and girls whoāve been abused and harassed. Thatās what this is about. So if youāre a man who just gets that youāre ahead of most guys. Okay, that aside, get off my feminist soapbox. That aside like it, and right there at the same at the same time, I say, guys, women still want men to be men. Itās not like you donāt want to be a man, we still can make moves, quote, unquote. But we want to be incredibly empathetic and always calibrating to how our quote unquote moves are making women feel. We want to Yes, you can still open doors and tell her sheās beautiful, and offer your arm or take her hand. But you also want to pay attention to how Of course how sheās responding to this, show a little thing called empathy, and then calibrate accordingly. Most women will let you know how youāre doing and how sheās feeling with you. And if sheās liking it, you can make a little bit more of a move. I think of it as stair steps. Thereās a story in the book, How I I was walking home from a date when I was first learning all this stuff. And I was like, Oh, no, I havenāt made any moves all night. I gotta do something. Weāre walking to the subway. He looks down on her phone. And then she looks up and all of a sudden my ginger face is coming at her to kiss her. And like my lips graze her chin and my teeth hits her and it was just oh word and I call it the lunch. Lunch because youāre like, well, I donāt want to get Yeah. lunging Puma. Yeah, thatās, thatās my kung fu name lunging. Donāt be the lunge guy. Iām not saying make. Iām not saying try to throw a touchdown from your own end zone. Iām saying baby, step it, you know, give her a hug when you meet her for the first time on the date. A friendly hug. A couple high fives be a little bit physically expressive. If sheās comfortable with it. Notice, notice how she responds. Maybe soon youāll be holding hands. If youāre holding hands, then maybe itās time for a kiss soon. But the me to trouble guys get into itās they do things like oh, Iām just gonna do nothing all night. And then Iām going to make some really weird try hard move, which is also really bad. I think of it as the stair steps of romantic connection rather than trying to throw a touchdown from your own five yard line.
Damona 42:27
I do not get the sports reference at all. Thatās okay. Sorry, sorry. Iām somebody somebody that was not for me. Thatās fine that somebody else will understand. But I think I get I get, I get the gist. And
Connell Barrett 42:41
the other thing
Damona 42:42
that I think itās important to remind folks of is that asking for consent can be really sexy. I think somehow we got in our head like, Oh, thatās not sexy. If I asked her if I can kiss her. Yes, of course it is sexy. Like, I mean, like, in olden times, they would say like, may I kiss you now? Or you know, just like, right? Would
Connell Barrett 43:03
it be okay, if
Damona 43:04
I kissed you? Like, how hot would that be? Like direct eye contact? Like? Would it be okay, if I kissed you right now? I feel like I want to kiss you right now. Is that okay? Like? Yeah, I feel like that would be super hot. Like, if thatās way hotter than you just like, shoving your tongue down my throat like,
Connell Barrett 43:23
absolutely. Itās nothing. Thereās nothing sexy about that. Whatās great is what you just described letting a woman know either explicitly, or with lots of clear cues that a kiss is coming. Youāve been moving toward it. And you could certainly say something like, well, I really want to kiss you right now. And then then what does what she taught you? Your answer, right?
Connell Barrett 43:46
So sheāll say like, sheāll
Damona 43:47
either say, letās break this down for folks coddle. Sheāll either say like, you should, or sheāll lean in. Or sheāll What? Like, what are some signs that sheās like, Oh, hell no.
Connell Barrett 44:00
Well, body language arms folded, sitting away from you. If you havenāt held her hand yet, then donāt try to kiss her yet. There are these little these little yellow, green, yellow or red lights that arise during the date. go through a few green lights first before you make a big move. And if you get yellow lights and red lights cool, then then you know to stop. And you never have to be that lunging guy. But absolutely. I have a client called Jerry, who. Heās got a great little move at the end of the date. Now he says are you in the market for a kiss? So cute. Itās a little bit cold. Itās COVID related. empathy. He wants to make sure sheās okay with that. Because weāre still in a pandemic, but also he wants to kind of test the waters like hey, basically, are you in the market for a kiss? And heās been to for two with that. So
Damona 44:52
if she doesnāt say are you in the market for a PCR test?
Connell Barrett 45:01
Any woman who said that he should propose right away?
Connell Barrett 45:03
Thatās right. Right away.
Damona 45:06
You are a wealth of helpful information I am so with you on this dating from an authentic place. And Iām so excited for my audience to pick up dating sucks, but you donāt the modern guys guide to total confidence, romantic connection and finding the perfect partner. And this is for I know you coach, guys, but thereās a lot for the ladies to be learning from your book as well.
Connell Barrett 45:29
I think so. I mean, the book is about how to gain confidence how to flirt, and how to make yourself attractive as your most real you I think thereās a lot of value there for men and women. But if nothing else, maybe you know, every womanās got a guy for you to friendzone who might need this, or a brother, or maybe a single dad. So itās itās good for guys and gals. And by the way, itās available, you can order it on my website dating, transformation calm, where I also have lots of free tips and videos and just free goodies as well.
Damona 46:03
Awesome. We will put the link to that in the show notes. As always, thank you so much for being here, panel.
Connell Barrett 46:07
Tonight, it was a blast. Thank you so much for having me.
Damona 46:09
Weāll put a link in the show notes for connells. Book dating sucks, but you donāt. The modern guys guide to total confidence, romantic connection and finding the perfect partner. This week, we have some fabulous questions to tackle from you, including how to avoid coming off as more of a friend on dates. And is he ghosting because heās secretly married.
Connell Barrett 46:34
Welcome back,
Damona 46:35
itās time to answer your questions in the next segment. This one comes to us in a voice memo from Brittany
britany what youāre doing here I think is really smart. You are noticing a pattern. And thatās what Iām all about. And I would not blame yourself, certainly. But I think itās a really good place to be willing to examine what youāre doing and see if thereās something that you are doing thatās creating the same result. Now first of all, I always say you know, rejection is your protection. So if itās not a match, you have to remember, itās actually a good thing that theyāre letting you know, first of all, that theyāre not just ghosting and theyāre saying, Hey, Iām not feeling the vibe. Of course, sometimes people say Iām getting a friend vibe, which means that Iām not interested in a relationship. So I donāt know if you are not stating clearly enough that you are interested in a relationship upfront. And then later on, theyāre like,
Connell Barrett 47:42
Oh, no, no, this
Damona 47:43
girl is looking for too much for me, actually, girl just want to be friends. I donāt know if thatās whatās happening. Or maybe there is something that you can do to sort of amp up the flirting. Weāll be talking more about flirting next week. But Iāll give you a couple quick tips that would be helpful. If you want to convey to the other person that youāre interested in something more than friendship. I canāt tell you how many times someone will say to me, I didnāt want to go out again with them because I felt like they werenāt really giving me vibes or they werenāt that interested. And like attracts like interest attracts interest. So make sure that you are really clear with what you want upfront. You can use my acronym, set it up s smile, make sure youāre smiling, youāre laughing youāre looking like youāre having a good time. He icontact of course, always make sure youāre really looking like youāre interested, you may have heard me say on the show before that just the presence of a cell phone on the table during a date can breed mistrust between two people. So make sure that youāre giving them good eye contact. And then touch touch is really the way to signify This is not just a friendship, Iām looking for something, something more. And there are a few zones in the body that are safe zones. And I really feel like since the me to movement, itās become very important for women to set the physical boundary and to let to let a man know that touch is okay. And advanced is going to be accepted. And you can do that by breaking the touch barrier first. So that could be just you know, casual little pat. On the hand when he says something funny or a touch on the shoulder while youāre walking to the table. It doesnāt have to be and probably shouldnāt be anything like vava voom major like no running the hand up and down the thigh thatās too much for their early phase. But safe zones, the shoulder, the elbow, the wrist, the hand, those tend to be safe areas where you can touch someone on a date, and it doesnāt come off as too aggressive. Anything Of course, hips, waist knee, you can maybe play a little bit of footsie. But sometimes those signals can get misread. But anything in the waist down zones is definitely off limits, especially guys, especially donāt put your hand on her waist or the small of her back. If you aināt there yet. You have to really respect that. But Iām saying to you, Brittany, maybe you need to amp up the float factor just a little bit. And see if you get a different result. I think itās really, really smart to examine these patterns that weāre seeing. Definitely not not for self blame. Iām not here for that whatsoever. But for self inquiry, that is what Iām all about on the day to mates podcast. So I hope that is helpful for you. But also just remember Brittany that those who want you to be in their life only as a friend, theyāre just not the right ones. And eventually, if you keep doing all of these things, and you keep being as curious about yourself, and as curious about your dates as you are, you will find somebody who likes you as more than a friend. Our next question came to me in an Instagram dm from a listener, weāll call a she says hi to Mona. I work at a hotel. And I met a guy here. Heās a returning guest coming every two to three weeks. After his third time, he gave me his business card to text him. So I texted him and we met two times and I felt we got a connection and got a bit intimate. Heās really great. We have a lot in common. But we were always in touch when he was at the hotel. Never when he was not around. Last time when we were saying goodbye. He said stay in touch, but we did not. He checked in yesterday, and I feel like thereās something wrong. He did not text me before. When we talked it was very formal. He was nice and told me it was good to see me and how Iām How am I doing? But thatās all Am I being ghosted? I know that it was very casual, and I donāt feel good about it. I donāt know what happened. But the worst thing is that I cannot ask for an explanation. Right? We were not together or exclusive. We were just hanging out. Moreover, hereās the kicker, guys. I found out that next week thereās another reservation under the same surname with a female name. Is this family or wife? What the heck is happening? Oh, man,
a man I I know what youāre going through right now. And I know Iām about to say something, thatās probably not what you want to hear. But this situation has a red flag written all over it even before you got to the part about the reservation under the same surname. All of my spidey senses were going off when you said I only talked to him when he was at the hotel. Never when he was not around. That to me is a telltale sign that this person, whether itās because he has a wife, or because he has a girlfriend or something going on at home, he cannot be available to you. So that to me says that heās hiding something if you only hear from someone, this is advice for everyone, right now, if you only hear from someone at certain times, like, Oh, well, I can only talk on the weekends or I only can talk during work hours or I canāt talk during work hours, thereās certain parameters around someone only being available to you on their terms. That is a red flag and should be paid attention to. Alright, so letās assume thatās the case a and letās say he has somebody back home but heās heās giving you all the fields and heās saying all the things you want to hear while heās in town. But hereās the part that concerns me for you A, youāre asking Am I being ghosted when I think the bigger question. Itās not about, heās not ghosting you. He is protecting his own his own interests. He is getting his needs met in this relationship with you. And then doing whatever the heck he feels like when heās not in the hotel. And heās not escalating the relationship. So itās not so much that heās ghosting you. Youāre not being ghosted, but itās just that thereās a mismatch between the fantasy that youāve created, understandably, based on the chemistry and connection that you had, and the reality thatās sitting here in front of you. I would certainly be suspicious that the same surname I donāt know if itās a common surname or not, with a female name, coupled with the fact that he has not been communicative with you and he was very standoffish when you saw him would add up in my mind to mean that this might be his wife. So I would back off, I would not, you can certainly ask for an explanation. But that doesnāt necessarily mean that youāre going to get one and of course, no one owes you an explanation in any dating or relationship. Since you But I think the question for you would be what can you learn from this situation? Or when could you ask for an explanation or clarification upfront, because if this is the industry that you work in, and this happens a lot of times with people who travel a lot, Iāve had clients who are flight attendants, whoāve had similar situations, even you know, waitresses, people who meet those who are on the go, who are out of their normal element, and feel that they can behave in a way that is not not the same as they would behave if they were at home. And people are really isolated and really lonely and really, really needing that connection with other people in the outside world. And I hate that you got caught up in this, because he clearly is getting what he needs and is not paying any attention to what heās leaving in the wake. But you can learn from us and you can take what experience youāve had here and apply it as a filter to your dating experiences or even flirtations. In the future. If you want a relationship, you can hold that person up to the level of expectation of communication and avail being available to you that you need. Or you can get the sign before you get the red flag that this person is not for you. I hope that is helpful for you A and I hope Brittany you got what you needed out of this episode. And I hope all of you at home enjoyed Episode 360 of dates and mates. We will put a link in the show notes for Connell Barrettās book dating sucks, but you donāt. The modern guys guide to total confidence, romantic connection and finding the perfect partner. And ladies, let me just tell you, you want to get the playbook you want to know what Cardinals telling the guys so you know how to do the dance, right? So I recommend for women or men to check out connells book. And Iād love to hear from yāall. I would love to hear your question. You can reach out to me on any of the socials at damona Hoffman, you can send me a voice memo like
right there in Instagram, you could literally just record and let me know whatās on your mind. And your question could get answered on a future show. And your question could get answered. And your question could get answered on a future show or you can call me leave me a voicemail 424-246-6255 Iāll be back next week with body language expert Nicole Moore, whoās going to help us regain some confidence and flirting skills as we move out into the real world. Until next week. I wish you happy dating
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